User talk:Elainefine


Uploads from WIMA

Hi Elainefine, and thanks for your helpful efforts to upload files here for the WIMA merge project. Unfortunately, since you did not use the proper WIMA automated file uploader, which is linked to on every work page ("Upload from external sources: Sibley, WIMA, FTP"), I regret that your uploads will have to be removed. The purpose of using the automatic uploader is to automatically log each file transferred; this cannot be done using the normal file submitter, and it is essential for the successful completion of the project. In addition, it would be most appreciated if you could sign up with the project before contributing to it, so it makes it easier to keep track of who is uploading what. Thanks, KGill talk email 15:31, 27 August 2011 (UTC)

Creative Commons Licenses, etc.

Dear Composer or Copyright Owner,

Welcome to IMSLP/Petrucci Music Library! As a composer or other copyright proprietor, please take time to carefully review the Creative Commons and Performance Restricted licenses including the full licenses in PDF format. Generally speaking, the best version to employ for new works is either the Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial-NoDerivs 4.0 or the Performance Restricted Attribution-NonCommercial-NoDerivs 3.0. These allow for free downloading of the items you post, yet prohibits anyone who downloads the files from IMSLP from selling the files (on Ebay, for example), or from giving public performances on an explicitly commercial basis, making recordings of the work without written permission in advance from you, the composer and copyright owner. However, if you are affiliated with a performing rights society such as SOCAN (Canada), ASCAP, BMI or SESAC (USA), SACD, SACEM or SEAM (France), SABAM (Belgium), GEMA (Germany), PRS (UK), SGAE (Spain), SIAE (Italy), Artisjus (Hungary), ZAIKS (Poland), IPRS (India), JASRAC (Japan), or any of the myriad of similar agencies present in this Wikipedia listing, please note that at least some of these agencies refuse to honor the Creative Commons licenses. You should therefore seriously consider using one of the several IMSLP Performance Restricted Licenses for any works posted here if you are affiliated with a performance rights society.

For those uploading the first time, please remember choose the menu option "Add Your Own Composition" when uploading your original works (even if they are scans of manuscripts or printouts), "Add Your Own Arrangement" or "(Re)Typeset" when uploading new arrangements, and "Add Your Own Edition" or "(Re)Typeset" when uploading new editions of public domain works. As it is normally assumed that composers and arrangers have edited their own work, please leave the "Editor" field empty unless another person has actually edited your work (in which case their name should be inserted). Note also that the English term "Editor" is not the equivalent of the French editeur or Italian editore. "Editor" refers to the person who reviewed and corrected the piece, while the French and Italian words are closer to the English word "publisher". In the "Publisher" field, please use your own full legal name, as making your scores and sound files available for free download on this site constitutes "publication" under the laws of most countries in the world. (Note that this is done automatically when using the new upload tools). Please do not list your works as "public domain" as it is not legally possible for your works to be fully public domain under the 'moral rights' provisions of many copyright statutes around the world. Composers and other copyright owners should be aware that Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 is very similar to public domain as it allows for the unrestricted copying, performance (live and broadcast) and recording of the work (including explicitly commercial use) at no charge, with no compensation or royalties payable to the composer or copyright owner for such commercial exploitation. Note also that the all of the above licenses are considered to be IRREVOCABLE once a file has been uploaded under the lawful copyright owner's authorization.

PS: As long as you have not actually inserted a particular Creative Commons license in the PDF file itself, you are free to change the license after upload to something more suitable. However, any restrictions under an updated license are only applicable to copies of the files downloaded after the date of amendment. Copies downloaded before amendment date are likely subject to the original license terms, so please choose carefully. Composers are also encouraged to make use of our new template {{NoPerf}}, which automatically places works into a new category - Unperformed Works. To add this template to your pages, simply copy and paste the little template above (curly brackets and all) into the "First Performance" field of the "General Information" section on all work pages.

Best Wishes,

Carolus 04:36, 28 August 2011 (UTC) (IMSLP Copyright Admin)

PS: For additional and more detailed explanation, please visit our Composer Portal page.

When I See Winter Return (Muset, Colin)

Hello Elaine. Pasting file information from another page is a very bad idea, but you can copy over the "Arrangements and Transcriptons" headers (i.e.the lines starting with "===" and "====="), if you need to, so long as you don't change the number of "=" symbols (which are automatically read by our system). I've fixed the file link on the page in question by using an earlier version of your text, which you may still need to update. Hope this helps — P.davydov 19:53, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

Mozart K.361, K.165

Arrangements of excerpts like these should always go on the page for the main work, so these have been moved accordingly — P.davydov 21:11, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

String Qt arr. of Sleeping Beauty, Grande valse villageoise

Dear Elaine,

wouldn’t that actually be an arrangement from the complete ballet (Op.66), rather than the suite (Op.66a)? I’d defer to the other Tchaikovsky experts for their opinion, rather than move it without further agreement on where it’s best placed. :-)

Regards, Philip @ © talk 23:54, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

Ah, it’s in both the suite and the ballet; it just never gets its full title when it appears in the suite. Aha. Ignore the above! PML
I've moved it from the page for the suite to the page for the ballet, where the other arrangements of this waltz can be found. "Grande valse villageoise" is an interesting title, but it's certainly not Tchaikovsky's! — P.davydov 05:43, 7 September 2011 (UTC)
On the other hand, I did move the excerpt arranged from the Marcello psalm, since it’s pretty obvious that Marcello himself was following the Vulgate/Septuagint numbering, where this is Psalm 18 rather than the Hebrew numbering of 19 – even though Marcello provided Hebrew intonations for synagogues! (At least this confusion is traditional confusion.) Cheers Philip @ © talk 02:11, 7 September 2011 (UTC)

Ian Keith Harris

I'm having a horrible time trying to upload the more than 30 files in Ian K. Harris' Consort of Carols from WIMA! There was a corrupt part, which I need to mention to Christian Mondrup. I'm not sure what to do!

Are you able to identify which file is the fly in the ointment, or do you get no indication of which file is corrupt? If the former, upload the remaining 29 and alert Christian of the problem. If the latter, you can use a “sieve” method to upload the files. Upload two groups of 15 files; one will fail. Divide the failed group into two groups of 7 and 8 files; one will fail. Continue on till you have 29 files uploaded and have identified the problem file! It’s easier to propose this method rather than follow it through and clean up the mess afterwards, however, so you are absolved from blame if you don’t. The uploader page seems rather sensitive to incorrect file names, as you no doubt have discovered already. Working out what had happened with one of the Amoris sets yesterday required some close attention.
I wonder if this I.K. Harris is the same one I knew about 20 years ago (very improbable I would think); he would get the nickname “Icarus” from the way his initials and surname were combined in his newspaper columns. Regards, Phi1ip 22:13, 7 September 2011 (UTC)

I believe that Harris lives in Australia. Anyway, I think that the only way to fix this is for me to download the separate PDF files and generate a score-and-part PDF file for each piece. It's a lot of work, but it should remove the problem part (it's the missing oboe parts from section IV and V that caused the problem).

We'll see!

I just uploaded section V as a score and part file.

Hi Elaine,
I was just in the middle of debugging the Consort of Carols when you uploaded the score and parts; our efforts crossed over.
Yes, I did meet Ian when I was an undergraduate at the University of Tasmania! I very much doubt he’ll remember me, though. He’s apparently now living in Sydney, and I’m in Melbourne.
It appears the three files which are causing problems loading from WIMA are:
  1. Oboe part, section IV
  2. Oboe part, section V
  3. Bassoon part, section II
I might extract those as separate files from the combined scores and parts and upload these, if that’s not treading on your toes.
Best regards, Philip @ © talk 23:39, 7 September 2011 (UTC)

My toes are fine! I think that we will need to get the parts from Ian.

If you want to write to him and ask it might be a good way to find out if he remembers you! If not, I'll write to him and get them. Let me know.

I discovered the Bassoon part was okay; it’s just the oboe parts from the last two sections that we’ll need to get from him. I’ll drop Ian a line shortly (I’m not sure we should leave his e-mail in clear sight for spammers to harvest, so I’ve hidden it).
The pieces for oboe d’amore (with alternates for oboe or cor anglais) look like a remarkable collection of intercontinental, musical love-letters for the virtuosi of those instruments! Cheers PML
E-mail sent; I cc’ed you in on it.
By the way, it would be very nice to have a photo (e.g. like this one) for your composer’s page, if you’re agreeable to that. These don’t need to be “officially” uploaded like IMSLP/WIMA submissions of scores and recordings; you can simply use this link (and ignore the warning!): Special:Upload
Regards, Philip @ © talk 02:20, 8 September 2011 (UTC)

When I See Winter Return (Muset, Colin)

Hi Elaine, first off -- thanks for all the wonderful submissions! Secondly, the typesets you uploaded to the work page above, and any others like it, must be submitted under a Creative Commons license. Even tho the composer is centuries dead, the fact that these are your own modern typesets and arrangements means that they cannot be classified "public domain". If you let me know which of the CC licenses you would like to use in this case I can make the change and clear the files for download easily. In the future, select "typesets" in file type when that is indeed what they are instead of "normal scan" -- the latter allows you to choose public domain as copyright status, the former does not. Cheers! Massenetique talk email 03:43, 8 September 2011 (UTC) PS: Ditto for Suite in G minor, BWV 995 (Bach, Johann Sebastian).

Massenetique, according to this page I think Elaine intended CC-by-nc-nd 3.0. Cheers, Philip @ © talk 05:46, 8 September 2011 (UTC)

Broken pages

Hello Elaine. When you're editing the pages, please take great care not to remove any "{{" or "}}" symbols, as doing so can "break" the page, making most of the text is invisible. Thanks — P.davydov 07:52, 13 September 2011 (UTC)

I tried to upload a picture, but I don't think I did it correctly! What did I do wrong?

Hi Elaine, I happened to notice the problems you were having with that. Take a look at your page now. You didn't need to enclose the file name of the photograph in anything after the Picture=. --Cypressdome 19:46, 14 September 2011 (UTC)


Dear Elaine, I note that you are apparently a member of ASCAP. We have been having some discussions with them about Creative Commons licenses, composers who upload their own works here, etc. I would be very interested in any thoughts you might have about this issue. I also noticed that none of the works posted here are actually listed in ASCAP's online database. Those that are appear to be published by Subito, Seesaw, Jeanne Music, etc. Do you have your own ASCAP entity? If so, we can easily set up something similar to that which is in place for Andreas Makris. Thanks, 07:12, 3 December 2011 (UTC) (IMSLP Copyright Admin)

I do have my published music listed in ASCAP, but, for various reasons I have decided that it is best for me not to send my newer music to the various publishersmI have worked with. The publishers do nothing in the way of publicity or promotion, and in some cases they seem to do their best to ignore me and my work completely! Since I only put CC music on the IMSLP, I don't think I need to do anything regarding ASCAP.

ASCAP is very good to me. They give me an award every year because I continue writing music and it continues to be performed. And they don't seem to discriminate between music that is owned by a publishing company and music that is offered freely by me.


Dear Elaine, The folks at ASCAP (Fran Richards, etc.) have told me point blank that they will not collect or pay on any Creative Commons license - even the more restrictive ones. One of the reasons we came up with the Performance Restricted license was in order to make it possible for composers to report performances to ASCAP, BMI, etc. as they normally do. We're trying to work with ASCAP, BMI and their non-US counterparts (only one of whom adamantly refuses to honor all Creative Commons licenses) as we understand that many composers would like to receive performance royalties. Once we get things squared away with ASCAP, we're hoping to work on a system whereby those downloading scores here can report performances to the appropriate society by filling out an attached PDF form and clicking a button to send to ASCAP, et al. BTW, there seems to have been quite a bit of copying of this site by sellers on Ebay (DVDs and CDs of PDF scores). You might want to take a look and see if your works are being sold by the various power sellers over there. Unfortunately, Ebay recently amended their policy on copyright violation complaints so that they take them only from the direct copyright owner now instead of responding to general complaints like those I've sent in the past about sellers violating the non-commercial restrictions on certain Creative Commons works. Carolus 04:01, 5 December 2011 (UTC)

Dear Carolus,

I just checked in Ebay, and it doesn't seem that they are selling anything of mine (though I did find out that there is an interesting-looking J.D. Salinger story from 1945 called "Elaine." It would be nice to be able to report performances of music to ASCAP, but it is not a major issue for me. I will keep an eye on ebay. I really don't like the idea of people selling my music in Ebay!


OK. Here's the place on Ebay where you're most likely to find someone selling scores of things ripped from this site. Carolus 04:22, 5 December 2011 (UTC)

I see. My only comment is "very like a whale."