User talk:Peter/archive

Free public domain sheet music from IMSLP / Petrucci Music Library
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July - October

Anonymous edits / vandalism

I agree that something should be done to prevent anonymous edits, or at least control them more closely. I have posted a message on the BB for Feldmahler. As far as I know it requires a minor change to one of the PHP files.

He's aware. Talk:Feldmahler --Emeraldimp 12:22, 24 July 2006 (CDT)

Main Page

Very nice idea for the main page! The only shortcoming I'd say is the two columns aren't balanced yet (the first one is quite a bit longer than the second one)... but I believe that can be fixed :) And there might be a way to have an automated "Recent Additions" list (maybe it can also balance the two columns?), I'll work on it right away. --Feldmahler 13:02, 30 August 2006 (EDT)

If "how to contribute" is placed out of the table, it's more or less even.
My idea for doing the recent additions manually is that an automated list would generate entries that are not so attractive on a main page (e.g. User talk:Peter, Category:Vocal (non-operatic), ...), so I thought of that box as a little place just to give attention to new uploads or special uploads, to make it more attractive and accessible to newcomers. But then again this will be hard to maintain manually... --Peter 13:11, 30 August 2006 (EDT)
Yeah, that was what I was thinking about too. The best result I thought was to put in a format where the composer's last name, work page and the IMSLP number of the most recent addition is noted (ex. "Bach: Cantatas, BWV 141-150 (IMSLP #1408)"), or if there are more than one file added, "Bach: Cantatas, BWV 141-150 (10 files)". The problem with maintaining this list manually is that it'll probably get out of sync very fast... unless there is a dedicated list maintainer (I'd think there are better jobs to do on IMSLP lol). --Feldmahler 13:20, 30 August 2006 (EDT)
Hmmm, maybe I should put the "how to contribute" back in the table as the list on the right will be growing. We can balance the lay-out by simply changing the length of the list on the right.--Peter 15:35, 30 August 2006 (EDT)
Yes, that might be for the best. Btw, I'm going to start testing this new automatic recent addition list feature, so be prepared for weird errors with the add file forms. However, none of the errors should be fatal; submission should still work smoothly (updating of recent addition list happens after all submission work is done). --Feldmahler 16:16, 30 August 2006 (EDT)
Ok. Finally finished the function. The question is how many scores do we want there? It's currently set at 3 for debugging purposes (so I don't have to submit 10 scores to see if it works). --Feldmahler 00:50, 31 August 2006 (EDT)
I don't see a list (yet?). And besides, how are we going to add other featured scores - or maybe that isn't your thing, I actually never asked someone elses opinion on that :).
Well... someone needs to submit something for the list to appear :) Actually, it might be a great idea to link the featured score list itself to another page. And btw, if you don't see the list appearing after you submit something, try refreshing the page. If that still doesn't work, you'll either have to wait for a few minutes and then refresh again, or just click "edit" and then preview (that should *always* do the trick). There should be a command to make the wiki flush its cache for the page, but I haven't found it yet.--Feldmahler 03:53, 31 August 2006 (EDT)
Apparently, this does the trick (scroll down to the bottom section about re-rendering). --Feldmahler 04:00, 31 August 2006 (EDT)
Works perfect! This is really great! Couldn't have done that scripting work myself...--Peter 04:07, 31 August 2006 (EDT)
Hehe, thanks :) Spent the whole day debugging it (which is why I was submitting Bach Cantatas like mad haha, before I ran out that is). --Feldmahler 04:19, 31 August 2006 (EDT)

Submission Error

Submitting this seems to work for me... maybe you misspelled the file name? Which submission page did you use, the single file one or the multiple files one (I used the single one)? Btw, you can edit that submission with the info and stuff :) If you still get errors with other submissions, let me know. --Feldmahler 04:41, 31 August 2006 (EDT)

Submission Error Followup

I finally found out why there are errors. I was looking at the error log for the file submissions page, and found the following lines (repeated a few times):

Sep 3, 17:20:21 EDT -- USER:Peter FILENAME:CPEBach_-_Sonata_solo_flute_a_min-fl-a4.pdf‎ --> CPEBach_-_Sonata_solo_flute_a_min-fl-a4.pdf‎ WORKPAGE:Flute Solo Sonata in a minor (Bach, Carl Philipp Emanuel) CALLERID:SAF ERROR:File not found. Please upload file before filling this form.
Sep 3, 17:41:15 EDT -- USER:Peter FILENAME:Saintsaens-Prelude_op99_no3.pdf‎  --> Saintsaens-Prelude_op99_no3.pdf‎ WORKPAGE:Prelude and Fugue in E-Flat Major, Op. 99 no.3 (Saint-Saëns, Camille) CALLERID:SAF ERROR:File not found. Please upload file before filling this form.

Apparently, there is some weird character at the end of the filename that is the problem. It could very well be some weird space (I know some IMEs use spaces that are not really normal "spaces"; they only look like spaces when your computer automatically displays unicode or whatever format the space is in). Basically the solution would be to delete all "spaces" from the beginning/end of the filename, and the problem should be solved :). (Btw, if your wondering what CALLERID is, it's just the page that called the error logging function [i.e. "Special:Add File" or "SAF"]). --Feldmahler 21:39, 3 September 2006 (EDT)

Mozart Concerto No.21

Nice job scanning that :) I myself had wanted this for a while, hehe... --Feldmahler 12:36, 29 October 2006 (EST)

Thank you... It did not know it. I´m beginner... :P


Isoldens Liebestod

Just a quick "thank you" for taking care of my Isoldens Liebestod faux pas (I prefer that term over the more nautical one)--Sphemusator 16:47, 23 June 2006 (CDT)

Non-PD template/categories

I've redirected the ComposernotPD template to the Copyright template because I thought that both are so closely related that it'd be confusing to have them separately, and also since the Copyright template itself does not say that there must be works that are in the PD in the US for that composer, just that there could be.

The reason I say this is confusing is that it's quite hard to be certain whether a composer had any works published before 1923 or not... the other problem is that sometimes composers themselves allow their works to be freely reproduced (I know two composers on IMSLP who are like this), so it's again quite hard to decide between ComposernotPD and the Copyright template (plus, the Copyright template includes all exceptions anyway). I think that the WorknotPD template is much more specific, and applicable in such cases where one might need ComposernotPD. However, if you had something else in mind just tell me :)

Also I thought it might be a good idea to put the tags at the top of the page, just so that it looks better... Otherwise, all is good :) --Feldmahler 20:01, 7 November 2006 (EST)

OK, It is indeed confusing and many composers would have double entries as they composed both before and after 1923. The work/file template will indeed be more specific. I changed the tables to the Copyright Template. I also updated the style of Template:File1923 and added a message in the comments box.

Tagging individual work pages vs. tagging composers

I was wondering whether tagging all work pages with the work-notpdusandeu template will be too much work? Maybe it is ok to tag the composer with ComposerNonPD-USandEU and, if the work page has a different copyright status, use the work specific tag? Just thought that'd lighten the load on the taggers :) --Feldmahler 19:00, 8 November 2006 (EST)

Well the reason I tagged the work is that some works by Rach are in that situation, while others are pre1923 and don't need a warning. So this work-tagging is useful for identifying those works that are not in PD in USA... I don't mind taking the tagging job for those few composers that died in 1936-1956...--Peter 15:39, 9 November 2006 (EST)
Well... I guess it's ok if you don't mind. Though that'd not be a light job. What I was suggesting was that it's more or less the same effect tagging the entire composer page vs tagging individual pages as long as the composer page tag says specifically that works published before 1923 is PD in the US (that's just my opinion). On the other hand, I thought a good idea for work pages was simply to indicate the date of first publication or composition (or even something like "after 1923" or "before 1923"), so that there isn't the redundancy of having the same tag for a whole bunch of pages; instead letting the user know the PD-ness of a work based on the info on the work page itself. But that's just my opinion; if you have something else in mind, feel free to tag the pages :) --Feldmahler 18:28, 9 November 2006 (EST)

.JS Files

I'm just very curious what those two .JS files are for... :) --Feldmahler 19:08, 11 November 2006 (EST)

This is about the Navigation Popups from Wikipedia. When hovering on a wiki link you get a very handy popup with a preview of the link, a diff preview, some administrative tools like reverting to older versions. Unfortunately it doesn't seem to work on IMSLP... Maybe you should try it on wikipedia! Yours, Peter 03:23, 12 November 2006 (EST)
Nice! It not working on IMSLP might be due to the fact that IMSLP still uses MediaWiki 1.7.1, while Wikipedia uses 1.9 beta... but I'll upgrade MediaWiki when I move the site, since it will take some time to move all the modifications over to 1.8/1.9. In the mean while I'll probably try it on Wikipedia, though I'm busy like mad recently :/ School projects just keep coming... --Feldmahler 20:43, 12 November 2006 (EST)


Hi Peter! I see you signed up for the BGA project... do you need the files, or do you already have them? If you already have them can you send one page from one of the files so that I can make sure it is the exact same scan/version? If you need a file just e-mail me and I'll send it to you. Thanks! --Feldmahler 17:06, 26 November 2006 (EST)

Lol, I was just typing some questions . I'll send you a page.
I didn't find the forum topic any more, so I'll post my question here.
1. I recently got a copy of the BGA. My edition is about 950MB in size, but I saw another download of 2 GB. What size are your copies? Would there be a quality difference?
2. On what do you rely for the BWV numbering? Would there be multiple versions of the Verzeichnis, like Köchel's?
1. Mine is 1.8GB, with an exceptionally large book 44 (which is around 500MB in size). I don't know about the 950MB one, but you can send me a page (or a book) and I'll compare the quality. There probably is a quality difference... but I don't have the 950MB version.
2. One thing about the BWV is that it seems much more static than KV... probably because Bach was so much earlier. There are different editions of the BWV (as can be imagined), but the idea is the same as KV (and, incidentally, the same as IMSLP's catalog system), and that would be:
1. under no circumstances will two pieces share the same catalog numbering even across different editions, and
2. if a piece is known by a certain catalog number in a previous edition, it will have the same catalog number in later editions even if the entry is only a stub which points to another number (like Mozart's K(1).54).
So there should be no confusion as to which piece it is even across different editions of the catalog. With that said, what I did for each work (or work series) was Google and confirm the catalog number with different sources. You might find these two sources especially useful: [1] and [2]
--Feldmahler 17:50, 26 November 2006 (EST)
OK, I'll download the bigger version, that will be easiest. Thanks for the help. BTW, who on earth scanned those thousands of pages !?--Peter 18:19, 26 November 2006 (EST)
No idea, but I'm very grateful to him/her/them :) I'd like to thank them properly, but I can't as I don't have the slightest clue as to who they are. --Feldmahler 18:24, 26 November 2006 (EST)

BGA Weirdities

I noticed that you submitted BWV 1030-32, and interestingly enough, Resnek has already submitted the same edition (in fact, the same scan; I compared the two and they are byte-identical), but Resnek's file (which he got from me; he was once part of the BGA project) is significantly larger. I compared the two PDF files and realized that my copy of the BGA was compressed in a sub-optimal format, and so I will probably be recompressing all previous BGA submissions (I'll write a script that does it). Anyway, what I wanted to say is, it's probably a good idea to avoid submitting pieces the BGA edition of which has already been submitted, even if that file is much larger than your version... I'll tell you when I finish recompressing the BGA files :) Also note that almost all (with very few exceptions) files in the Bach category are from the BGA (and sub-optimally compressed)...

Also, I see that you seem to be able to read German quite well, which is great :)--Feldmahler 11:32, 29 November 2006 (EST)

Very interesting. That will probably the reason why my 900MB version is the same quality as the 2GB version. Is it another TIF compression algorithm that is used?

And about the German, well I speak Dutch, which is somewhat related to German. It's good enough to identify the Anhange or appendixes but I don't completely understand why they are there - that's why I refer to the introduction.Peter 11:41, 29 November 2006 (EST)

At least Dutch is much closer to German than English :P
About the compression, the version I had uses Flate compression (LZW generic lossless compression), while yours uses CCITT Group 4 (monochrome specialized lossless compression). Also, did you submit those files from the 900MB version? --Feldmahler 11:45, 29 November 2006 (EST)
Yes it's from the 900mb version. So I won't have to download the 2GB version...
I finished compressing the files with my script... most of the BGA files were compressed by around 40%... too bad a lot of the BGA pages still have a static file size instead of the filesize tag :/ I guess that's not that important though... as long as the files themselves are smaller :) --Feldmahler 11:23, 30 November 2006 (EST)


Schubert: Octet(s)

Hi Peter,

This Octet is not the same one as that which you posted from the Variations project. The D. 72 and 72a are fragments of an early attempt (1813). The famous Octet is D. 803 - composed 11 years later. Retrieved from ""

Gade: Elverskud, Op. 30 (The Erl-King's Daughter)

Hi Peter,

Thanks for posting the MSS for this work here. Really interesting. I think that it has somehow been placed in the wrong work's page, namely that of the ballet Et Folkesagn (A Folk Tale), Link: I'll post this over at the discussion page for Elverskud and drop a note to Feldmahler as well. Thanks for all of your great finds. It really helps in making IMSLP the best free music site on the net.

Best Wishes,


Thanks for the note, I don't know how it got there. I'll move the file. Btw, what does MSS mean?
Cheers, Peter

MSS = manuscript. In this case it's the composer's autograph, with Gade's musical signature on the last page. (He spelled out the notes G-A-D-E.) Librarians sometimes use the term "holograph" as well.

Schubert Octet Deletion?

Hi Peter! I was browsing the Articles for Deletion category and found the Schubert Octet D.803 there, but I couldn't find the revision where you added the Deletion category tag, so I'm not sure if you still want it deleted? I don't see anything wrong with it as it is, so I'm not sure... --Feldmahler 20:31, 20 December 2006 (EST)

No, that page is correct, it must be a consequence of the octet confusion...--Peter 04:16, 21 December 2006 (EST)

Copyright Violations concerning Poulenc

I am really sorry for uploading music sheet that violates the copyright laws in IMSLP, honestly. However, I would like to mention that the Poulenc scores were the first ones I uploaded, and as soon as I uploaded them, I read the copyright policies, and I found out I was wrong, but I didn't know how to delete them (I found no "delete" button in the pdf file page), so I just let them be and I would send you a message (once I also figured how to do that, because I don't know if this is the correct way) informing you about that so a moderator/admin could delete the scores for me. I am deeply sorry again, and I will take more care in the future when uploading scores of more modern composers. I also have to tell you that I love this community and I hope it will continue to grow in faster rhythms from now on :) Take care!


P.S. I think one of the pieces was composed in 1923? So, isn't this ok with the copyright violations, even for the 70 years of USA? (just asking)

Lol, first I was going to say you are too fast, because I just uploaded it and saw the mistake and run immediately to correct it, and then as I read your note (after correcting it), I see your other reply "oh, you already corrected it" and I am like "wth" :D :D :D Haha :) Nevermind, sorry for the confusion :) Anyway, I'll continue and try to be even more careful now, heh :)

Using ZIP instead of many many many PDF files?

Hey there again... I have all of Scarlatti's sonates for harpsichord. However, there are 175 of them :O I was thinking that uploading them in groups of 25 (as they are small in size, and groups of 25 wouldn't be larger than, say, 600-700kb in total, after being zipped) would be much more convenient, as uploading by hand and making files entries for 175 pieces can be a real PITA (sorry for the expression) (and sorry for saying "wth" in my previous comment too, I was just a bit surprised...). If not, then I'll try to upload 10 pieces a day and have it ready in half a month or something (because I want to upload other stuff too). Also, I hope there is no "flooding" problem with uploading too many pieces, as i have, in such a short timespan, or else tell me and I will reduce my frequency of uploads (I am just too excited to take part in this :D :D ). Thank you for your time again, take care! :)

P.S. Sorry to disturb again, but I think I did something dumb again... I am not sure if I am eligible to do this or not, so I've taken it back, and I am asking you whether normal users can post in the Featured Scores list in the main page, and/or add to the News list. Sorry for doing both without asking you first, I've removed what I did before I am sure whether I can or cannot do this. Thanks again :)

Thanks Peter for notifying me on my talk page (there are so many edits in the last few days I've had trouble going through them). I've responded to your user talk page, Jujimufu. Sorry about the delay... I was on the road for the last few days and had no internet access :( But I'm happy that IMSLP seems to be running quite smoothly while I was away :) --Feldmahler 23:23, 27 December 2006 (EST)


January / February

Handel's Concerti

Hey there. I noticed there is some kind of problem with the last Handel concerti I am uploading. It seems that, although I go to the Handel page, under Composers, and I click on "add a file", it adds that file under Handel, George Frideric Handel, instead of Handel, George Frideric. I don't know why this has happened. Any ideas on how to move the files from one composer to the other, without deleting all of them? Thanks for the help though :)

Ok, so I moved the files back to the original composer's page, and had the faux one marked with "articles for deletion". Oh, and one more thing; how do you do that "indented reply" thing to a previously posted comment? Thanks! jujimufu 18:01, 1 January 2007 (EST)

Brahms' variations

Hi Peter,

I noticed that the last page (no. 23) of the Brahms' "Variations on a theme bij Händel (opus 24)" is actually the first variation from "Variations on a theme by Paganini, Book I"... This variation, by the way, is missing where it is supposed to be.abelard, 18 January 2007 (EST)

Thanks for notifying me of the pdf error. I will delete the page. Can you tell me if the first paganini variation is missing or not?--Peter 05:58, 18 January 2007 (EST)

Peter, The first Paganini variation is indeed missing. .abelard, 22 January 2007 (EST)
fixed!--Peter 13:43, 22 January 2007 (EST)
great!--Abelard 18:43, 23 January 2007 (CET)

Plate number

Hallo Peter,

thanks for the tip. Indeed I was not sure whether I should fill in the plate number when there's no name of the publisher on the sheet.

Still I have some questions: I collected a lot of scores in the internet, from pages which are linked on this site and also from others which are a bit more difficult to find. And all offer/offered scores for free downloading. So I can expect that all of them are already considered as public domain, can't I? Or do I have to verify this again before uploading?

Shall I fill in the website where I got it from (provided that I still know it)? Sometimes I've seen this on the pages here.

If there's only the plate number on the score, do I have to try to find out the publisher or can I just type then Unknown?

I hope I don't bother you with these questions ;-) Bye, Björn

IFLANG nesting

I finally managed to fix the bug... IFLANG should work correctly when nested :) --Feldmahler 16:05, 21 January 2007 (EST)

Watch out for Gershwin


I noticed in your pending file that you will be doing Gershwin's Rhapsody in Blue. While I'm sure it would be immensely popular, the work is still under copyright, and the Gershwin estate/Warner Bros more than vigorously defend the copyrights on this work. In fact, this is one of the primary works that caused the Sonny Bono act to be rushed through in the middle of the night to halt PD at 1923 (with just a year to spare). Just imagine if United no longer had to pay to use RiB for it's commercials.

Copyright only extends life +50 in canada (where this site is hosted), putting gershwin's music just into the public domain, including the 2 piano version of rhapsody in blue ()which i believe is the one peter is planning to upload), but not any of the orchestrations as they were done by grofe, who didn't die till more recently.--Matthew 11:31, 25 January 2007 (EST)

Deuxième Récréation de Musique

Hi there Peter! Just a heads up... an editor of the WIMA left you a message here. Keep me posted about what happens :) --Feldmahler 11:30, 24 February 2007 (EST)


IMSLP #02089

Hi Peter! For some reason, #02089 on Polacca_brillante,_Op.72_(Weber,_Carl_Maria_von) does not want to open... I know you submitted this some time ago, but I was wondering if you have any idea why the file cannot be opened (maybe upload corruption?)... or if you still have the original file you uploaded, can you check if at least that opens? Thanks! --Feldmahler 00:19, 4 March 2007 (EST)

The file on my HD is intact, and the downloaded file causes a crash of Acrobat... I'll re-upload it.--Peter 04:57, 4 March 2007 (EST)


Hi Peter! I've added you as an admin. I think that IMSLP's expansion necessitates another admin, and you are already very familiar with how IMSLP works :)

Anyway, welcome to the admin group, and have a look at the IMSLP:Policy page that I just created :) --Feldmahler 12:20, 4 March 2007 (EST)

Thanks for your appreciation! --Peter 12:35, 4 March 2007 (EST)

False Bach attributions

Hi Peter! I was thinking about this, and thought that it might be a good idea to submit duplicates of the files to Bach pages even if they were falsely attributed to Bach, just so that people don't wonder where the "missing" works are. Of course, you can use either the add file form or simply copy and paste the code. Just throwing the idea out there :) --Feldmahler 15:54, 5 March 2007 (EST)

PDF question

Hi, I have a question for you since you make scans in pdf. When I save pdf files each page turn out to be over 1 mb, is there any setting to change to make the pages smaller in filesize? --Funper 08:32, 17 March 2007 (EDT)

Hi, I have another question. When saving pdf files, how do one change the dpi so that the quality and files size is balanced? (e.g. not to high dpi on a low quality score) --Funper 18:05, 17 March 2007 (EDT)

Regarding your question on Franck's short pieces for harmonium

Hi Peter, well it seems to be a kind of piano transcription of Franck's pieces. For instance No.I and No.X were originally writen for piano. The rest it's for the harmonium. However a close inspection of the score reveals that the harmonium registration was deleted and an even closer inspection reveals some fingering which led me to think that these are piano transcriptions. All the pieces are from the organist excep No. VI and No. XIV which were not included in L'Organiste. However Franck wrote some pieces for the harmonium more than 20 years before composing the unfinished L'organiste. I pressume that this two pieces come from that set; I will check. I recall reading somewhere about the 'Prelude pour l'Ave Maria Stella' as being composed for the harmonium well before L'Organiste and included in a set of pieces for the harmonium. Hope this serves; IMHO this should be renamed as they are for piano not for the harmonium. Cheers


Theodore Dubois

Peter, I also exchange the order on Theodore Dubois, sorry again for that could you please fix it? I don't know how to do it. Cheers / nachoBA

April 2007

Soler's Sonatas

Hi Peter, I do not have his permission, though in his site one can read that he is posting the stuff as "public domain"(See here ). I've pressumed that this is enough to upload the stuff to the IMSLP. Let me know if you believe that an express permission should be asked. Cheers / nachoBA

Hehe... we are talking on three user talk pages at once ;) Anyway, I've also commented on NachoBA's user page. Basically, I believe we are in the clear, just that it might be a good idea to note this on the work pages to prevent trouble. --Feldmahler 19:03, 1 April 2007 (EDT)

Trois etudes

There is only the third! Where is the rest? --Funper 11:55, 4 April 2007 (EDT)

I'm sure Peter would have posted them if he had them... or else it'd make no sense to post only one :) --Feldmahler 12:22, 4 April 2007 (EDT)

Hungarian Rhapsodies Copyright review?

Hungarian Rhapsodies are all PD. 1972+25=1997. --Funper 09:50, 9 April 2007 (EDT)

Budapest is not in Germany.--Peter 10:08, 9 April 2007 (EDT)
Neue Liszt-Ausgabe was also published in Germany. Isn't Hungary a member of Berne [3]? --Funper 10:19, 9 April 2007 (EDT)
OK, I didn't follow the whole Berne thing, so I'm not into it... That's why I proposed it for review (a little overshooting maybe, but the LAST thing I want for IMSLP is legal problems, and this German 25y term is IMHO really on the edge). I'd rather have some files less on IMSLP than a lawsuit... Don't take it personal! --Peter 10:30, 9 April 2007 (EDT)
Less files on IMSLP, Less Liszt-files on IMSLP rather than a lawsuite?! I take it very personal..! No but on the other note, since Neue Liszt-Ausgabe was also indeed published in Germany, and since Berne rule and all that stuff apply there I do think that it is out of copyright. I am 99.95% sure that it is a "scientific" edition and hence PD in Canada, but ask Feldmahler, he is all into copyright laws. --Funper 10:40, 9 April 2007 (EDT)
Ok, let us quit arguing and ask Carolus for a copyright review :) --Feldmahler 11:09, 9 April 2007 (EDT)
Hi Peter and Funper, I've been doing some checking on the Neue Liszt Ausgabe. The series is a type of joint venture between Editio Musica Budapest and Baerenreiter. In light of the fact that all the editors of the first eight volumes are Hungarian, it would appear that the primary publisher is actually EMB, with Baerenreiter mainly acting as distributor for the West (back in the days when Hungary was still a Soviet satellite). Hungarian statutes would be the ones governing here, not the German law. The series has not been reprinted by any of the reprint houses here in the USA, most likely due to the fact that it only started to appear in 1970, well past the date of automatic renewal for copyrights in the US (1964). Absent a EU law which over-rides the Hungarian law, I think the weight of evidence places the entire series in the "still protected by copyright" category. I think we should refrain from posting at IMSLP. -- Carolus 10 April 2007

Some questions concerning Muzika and CDSM

Hi Peter, I have some Russian editions from scores (Medtner), some with M. <number>, others only with numbers on the bottom....I think they are from Muzika. As far as I know, scores of Muzika don't have copyright any more. So can I upload them without hesitation (even if the edition is from the early 80s) or are there still some exceptions/open questions? What about those editions with numbers only, I'm not 100% sure whether they are really from Muzika. Is there a database of Muzika Edition/Plate Numbers anywhere in the Internet apart from the Julliard Site?

Another question refers to scores from "CD Sheet Music" and similar: can scores from those companies always be uploaded? Of course, its necessary to remove the Logo from each page before, but can I be sure that the scanned music they sell is always Public Domain? (...maybe they make an arrangement with publishers and scan also music which is still under copyright?). What I noticed is that there's no publisher information on the pages any number, nothing. Well, I think, I'll remove not only the Logo, but also the title and all headings...only will leave the page numbers :) Hobbypianist 09:44, 26 April 2007 (EDT)

I'm moving this discussion to the forums because more people can look at it :) Here's the thread. --Feldmahler 10:59, 26 April 2007 (EDT)

Sonata for Piano Four-Hands in Bes K.358 (Mozart, Wolfgang Amadeus)

In German, "B" is our B♭; "H" is our B. Therefore, having a German "Bes" is rather redundant (and almost suggesting a B♭♭). With your permission, I would like to move this article to Sonata for Piano Four-Hands in B K.358 (Mozart, Wolfgang Amadeus). Springeragh 15:43, 27 April 2007 (EDT)

Hello. You speak of a German Bes, which I couldn't find in the following title: Sonata for Piano Four-Hands in Bes K.358. This is an international website, and we are not in Germany... Although the main page and some other pages may be translated in German, the work titles are for the moment the same for all languages. The H and B naming is indeed German but not normative. In (parts of) the rest of Europe, Bes is used, and is not ambiguous. On IMSLP we haven't concluded yet which language (the original or a translation) should be used for the title. Moving the page to ... in B flat major of B♭ would be an alternative if you can't stand the Bes.
Peter 17:19, 27 April 2007 (EDT)

I'm from Poland, in our naming system, the english B is H, the B flat is B OR Hes, and english B with double flat is Heses, Bes is incorrect there.

May 2007

Fiori Musicali.

No, I don't asked for permission. But, WIMA is not a owner of this typeset. As well as IMSLP is i.e. not a owner of scans contributed by me. So IMSLP can prohibit copying the file record, with all informations, because it's owner is IMSLP staff, but IMSLP cannot prohibit copying scans, am I right? So i think that only one person who have rights to typeset is it's author. And in part me, as well as i am author of cover.
All the best,

This is true, but the default WIMA copyright is so that redistribution by other online archives is specifically forbidden: [4]. From my experience, WIMA contributors will generally agree if you ask for permission; I mean, they usually have no reason to refuse. You can just write a short e-mail, wait for the response, and everything is fine :) --Feldmahler 17:28, 5 May 2007 (EDT)

"So i think that only one person who have rights to typeset is it's author." That's true: the author has copyright - you can't find any public domain or free content license anywhere in the file. So it would be nice to acknowledge his rights and all his hard work and ask for his permission (the authors adresses are on WIMA). Probably they will be glad to do so, as they did for other files. Can you let us know if we have permission? Thanks.
We were discussing this also in the forum. Cheers, Peter talk 18:44, 5 May 2007 (EDT)

decent scanner

hello peter. i have just recently discovered stockholms music library and apparently they have a very nice addition of old pd scores. but i don't know what kind of scanner i should buy. i mean all the 4800x4800 dpi / 9600x4800 dpi are getting me confused, is 4800x4800 dpi enough for a decent monochrome sheet scan? best regards --Funper 10:25, 6 May 2007 (EDT)

Sure! Be careful, the advertised resolution is not always the real scanning resolution but sometimes an interpolated resolution, meaning that the scanner is converting internally a real resolution of 1200dpi to 9600 dpi. Normally 600 to 1200 dpi reprints, properly scanned and printed at the same size, are indistinguishable from the originals, so almost all scanners nowadays are sufficient concerning resolution. Other factors playing in the quality is the glass quality (I had a Brother scanner with parts not even in focus), scanning speed, color quality, automatisation possibilities in the software... You can also think of having an autofeeder to do the work, but this needs the pages to be separated, something you can't do with a library score I suppose ;} --Peter talk 10:38, 6 May 2007 (EDT)
Haha i thought of an autofeeder to, but the pricetag on that is 16000 kr! the pricerange for scanner are everything from 35 kr (4$) to much more... i also need to scan some old photos... i think i am going to buy something like HP ScanJet 4890 Photo Scanner.. it has 4800x9600 dpi (optical), 28 sec/page, 48-bit color.. would this be good? sorry for troubling you with all these questions, but i really have no idea --Funper 11:22, 6 May 2007 (EDT)
I suppose that would be good, but maybe read some reviews on the net. I had only a negative experience with the HP scanner software, three years ago, but don't know if that's still a problem and to what extent it is a problem for you. The software was too much wizards, autocorrection, et cetera, while I needed just a simple TWAIN interface that gives what you want.Peter talk 11:28, 6 May 2007 (EDT)
I bought this scanner and it has worked really well for me. It's very fast at 300 dpi, and quite a bit slower at 600 (probably 5 pages a minute) but the autofeeder works great.--Goldberg988 11:30, 6 May 2007 (EDT)

IMSLP #03575

Hi Peter! Violin Sonata No. 1, Op. 73 (Raff, Joseph Joachim)'s piano part, IMSLP #03575, seems to be corrupted; I checked with both xpdf and acrobat reader, and I downloaded with Firefox. Do you still have the original file? Thanks! --Emeraldimp 11:45, 7 May 2007 (EDT)

Great; thank you! I'll check it again in a day or so, when everything's updated. --Emeraldimp 13:00, 7 May 2007 (EDT)

Raff No.5

Hi Peter! Apparently you accidentally uploaded Sonata No.4 instead of No.5 onto the Raff No.5 page... and so I've uploaded the correct files, and it should be fixed now.

By the way, I really like your music barnstar! :) --Feldmahler 14:22, 7 May 2007 (EDT)

Thanks, to be honest, I copied it from wikipedia, but Goldberg has such fantastic scans! Peter talk 14:27, 7 May 2007 (EDT)
Hehehe... this is true :) --Feldmahler 14:33, 7 May 2007 (EDT)

health care breakthrough?

Hi Peter - Your new page on Johann Christoph Erselius says that he lived to be 193. Please let me know what vitamins he was taking! Physicist 12:12, 26 May 2007 (EDT)

I'm willing to sell information :) I just don't know the year of death, and the system needs one. Peter talk 15:12, 26 May 2007 (EDT)

Hi again - Bad news, it looks like Erselius died at 69. Erselius isn't in the New Grove online, but I did a search at (you need academic access), and I found this:

  Author: suppress (qqq) - Heller, Karl
  Title: Die Klavierfuge BWV 955: Zur Frage ihres Autors und ihrer
  verschiedenen Fassungen
  Translated: The keyboard fugue BWV 955: Its attribution and various versions
  Source: In: Das Fruhwerk Johann Sebastian Bachs: Kolloquium veranstaltet vom
  Institut fur Musikwissenschaft der Universitat Rostock 11.-13. September
  1990 Koln: Studio 1995 p. 130-141
  Special Features: music
  Language: German
  Class: Historical musicology (Western music): To ca. 1750 (Baroque)
  Abstract: The B-flat major fugue, BWV 955, has hitherto been considered an
  arrangement by Bach of a G-major fugue by Johann Christopher Erselius (ca.
  1703-72), a hypothesis now disproven by source and textual studies. The
  G-major version is actually a transposition of an early version (BWV 955a)
  of the B-flat major fugue; both date from Bach's early years as a
  Descriptor: >Bach, Johann Sebastian -- works -- fugues, BWV 955 --
  >Erselius, Johann Christoph -- works -- fugues -- attribution -- relation to
  Bach fugue, BWV 955
  >attribution and authenticity -- Bach, J.S. -- fugues, BWV 955
  Document Type: as -- Article in a symposium
  Accession No: 95-03209-as
  Database: RILM_Music_Abstracts

So this tells us when Erselius died (assuming Karl Heller got it right), but it seems to say that the fugue really is by Bach. I haven't actually read Heller's article. Physicist 19:12, 26 May 2007 (EDT)

category page (high quality scans)

delete? see Category talk:High Quality Scans --Funper 14:21, 26 May 2007 (EDT)

Go ahead. Since the quality rating system the category is indeed passé . However, I think a quantitative appreciation like resolution works better to discern screen/printable/high quality. There is still a difference between printable and print quality.Peter talk 15:02, 26 May 2007 (EDT)

Dussek Sonatas

Sorry for the delayed response... Publication info can be obtained here: I hope to get all 29 uploaded within the next month or so.

June 2007

Empty work pages

Hello Peter, just to remind you that the work page Cantatas, BWV 220-224 (Bach, Johann Sebastian) which you have created, currently doesn't have any submitted files. --Leonard Vertighel 16:26, 1 June 2007 (EDT)

Thanks. When finishing BGA, I'll remove it if they are not included in the BGA.--Peter talk 17:29, 1 June 2007 (EDT)


Hi Peter, what a surprise when I logged in today, thanks very much for the nice star :) Hobbypianist 19:30, 3 June 2007 (EDT)

By the way, I just tidied up the Alkan category (was a bit mess due to missing Op.-numbers and double workpages). You have created workpages for the Concerto, Symphony for Piano solo and the Variations Le Festin d'Esope, which are all parts of the 12 Etudes, Op.39. Shall I move them to this workpage? But maybe you did this intentionally, well, these works are probably the best-known pieces of this set of Etudes. Just wanted to ask you before I change it. Regards :), Hobbypianist 10:30, 4 June 2007 (EDT)

Go ahead and make the work page you think is best - I don't have much knowledge of the Alkan works.. Peter talk 11:37, 4 June 2007 (EDT)

Beethoven's Piano Sonata No. 17

Hello Peter, I downloaded your PDF for Beethoven's Piano Sonata No.17 Op.31 No.2. As I was scrolling through to check it out, I noticed that if you refer to the page numbers on the actual score, it goes page 7, 8, 11, 10, 11. Where is page 9? This only really caught my attention because the first page 11 had a minor defect which seems to be fixed on the second page 11. Thanks for the music contributions. --GT

Which edition? I supplied two editions. Peter talk 13:07, 5 June 2007 (EDT)
My apologies, the IMSLP #03165 from the Library of Congress, 26 Pages, Publisher is Boston: Oliver Ditson & Co, 1876 (U.S. edition of J.G. Cotta's edition, Stuttgart), Editor: Sigmund Lebert, Immanuel Faisst (english translation by J.C.D. Parker). --GT
I checked LOC, and I'm sorry, but it appears that the error is on the originals by the library of congress. So I can't really do much about it! Peter talk 15:53, 5 June 2007 (EDT)
No apologies necessary. Thanks for looking into it! --GT


Hey Peter, thanks for the note. I just had minor surgery last week, so since I'm off work and can't play the piano at the moment I have plenty of extra time to use up. Therefore, I've just been trying to pick a couple composers a day and upload as much of their complete works as I have. Hopefully, seeing the composers name on the works added list will encourage people to take a look and add any opus #'s not in my collection. Most of the scores I've posted are what I've been able to collect the last few years off the internet, which obviously allows me to be able to post a great deal more material since I don't have to use time scanning. I've tried to give attribution when I remember or can see where I got the file from, but since most are just postings from message boards and are possibly several years old I'm not able to give credit to the original scanner on many of them. I've also tried to list as much of the copyright info as I could figure out from looking at the scores, but up until a few days I didn't know anything about copyright law or music publishing, so I'm trying to learn as aI go along and relying on the help of others. While giving credit where it is due is an admirable goal, (and I certainly appreciate the efforts of those scanning material on this site & others) I think the most important thing is to make many of these great works easily accessible to the musical community and to encourage people to examine and play lesser known works which they otherwise might not have come accross (this has certainly been my hope with my postings of works from such composers as Bortkiewicz, Catoire, Liadov, Heller, etc.) Anyway, thanks for helping to run such a great site. It is really a terrific resource & I hope it can continue to grow and become better known.

IMSLP #7219 - Can you delete it?

Yesterday I've submitted Verdi - Aida - trascrizione per Organo IMSLP #07219, but the pdf image was corrupted. Now I have uploaded a new version, IMSLP #07340, that is correct. Can you delete the old 7219 ? Thanks - Vinicio

Done. Peter talk 15:02, 8 June 2007 (EDT)

BGA Book 44

Hello Peter, yes, I have contributes a few files to the BGA project. I have downloaded the original scans from, where I found all BGA volumes except for nr.44. So I am at the moment unable to upload any manuscript scans from vol.44. If there is a downloadable version elsewhere, I would like to process and submit it. I am anxious to see this wonderful project of IMSLP completed! Fdamiani 12:45, 14 June 2007 (EDT)

Well... I believe there is a reason why Book 44 isn't offered for download on Tarakanov; the file is more than 500MB large (correct me if I'm wrong Peter, the other files in my set of the BGA scans has worse compression than yours, so yours may be smaller?). It is a set of manuscripts, and scanned in color, hence the size. Unfortunately, I don't know where to get it; I got my set from ed2k/emule.
And also, I wanted to ask Peter whether you have any idea about how to do Book 44? I haven't looked closely at it so I don't know if it's possible to split into reasonable sized chunks? Do you know roughly what it contains? --Feldmahler 21:29, 17 June 2007 (EDT)
Hmm very strange - mine is 116 Mib of grayscale manuscripts. However, they are only extracts of a few pages per piece. I uploaded the first manuscript as an example. Acrobat can reduce the file size further, but the result would only be compatible with acrobat 7.0 - probably the compression is jpeg 2000. I uploaded such an example here. Is it readable.
What do you think - you prefer the color version (if I could get it) or the grayscale? Peter talk 03:19, 18 June 2007 (EDT)

Duplicated submission...

Hello Peter,

I have realized that I have submitted a manuscript scan (from end of BGA Band 1) which you had already submitted. I had incorrectly read that it was BWV 1, while it is BWV 3; it is still found at the end of the Bach Cantatas 1-10 page. Could you delete it?

By the way, I found BGA vol.44 at (although this file has a lot of missed/duplicated pages). The detailed list of manuscripts published is found in the preface, pages 15-21.

Thanks, Fdamiani 10:54, 18 June 2007 (EDT)

I'll delete my larger version of BWV3. And thanks for the link! What do you think? Is it worth uploading the large color version or is the grayscale sufficient? Cheers Peter talk 11:26, 18 June 2007 (EDT)


Hi Peter, since you're online I talk to you ;). I have several scores of piano music by Smetana, all from Editio Supraphon. The editions are from the mid-80s, revised by Jan Novotný. Are really all publications by Supraphon Public Domain or are there exceptions? Hobbypianist 13:34, 22 June 2007 (EDT)

Toccata quasi Fantasia

I want to say, that exactly that piece is included in complete edition of Purcell's
works, wich I have uploaded. The same with suite in G Major.
Always with fresh and rare scans,

Re: Schubert Lieder

Hi Peter,

Thank you for the note about the Schubert Lieder scans, I'll use your publisher field format from now on. I probably won't have a lot of time over the next few days...Mondays and Tuesdays I start work a bit later, so I have time to sneak in some uploads in the morning.

I think I've managed to get the quality of the scans a bit better than what they were in the beginning, but I still have the odd headache with trying to get it perfectly squared and aligned! Not easy with a miniature score, whose binding has a mind of its own!

It's been a pleasure watching IMSLP grow so rapidly, and I hope I can continue to contribute some useful stuff.


Clara Schumann's Piano Concerto

I have an edition of the Clara Schumann's Piano Concerto Op.7, But This edition was published by Hildegard Publishing Company on 1993. So what I will know is if there is some problem about publishing this material, I hope that it does not find problem with it. Thanks [[5]]


Cyril Scott

Hi Peter, nice new scores from Scott :). Following the download links ( it seems that the files are on IMSLP and not on the US server. Could you check this please? Hobbypianist 16:22, 5 July 2007 (EDT)

Correct, I didn't think of it. I can't move them myself, so I have filed a request at IMSLP:US server uploaded request. By the way, I see you renamed some pieces by Scott. I'm not sure if they were published as sets of piano pieces - I couldn't find common titles. See you, Peter talk 04:08, 6 July 2007 (EDT)
Hi, the Op.47 of Scott can be found as 'Two Piano Pieces'. Concerning the others I thought it would be better to merge pieces with the same Opus (thus I understood the corresp. paragraph in the submission guide). But of course I'll undo this immediately if you prefer seperate workpages! Please tell me. Hobbypianist 04:46, 6 July 2007 (EDT)
No, it's okay... :) I don't think it matters that much. Peter talk 06:21, 6 July 2007 (EDT)

Fwd: Little request

Hi Peter, I'm "forwarding" you this request from Feldmahler -- I believe that the user in question is Dutch (and not German), so maybe you can help? Thanks, --Leonard Vertighel 15:07, 10 July 2007 (EDT)

Publisher info field

Hello Peter, Thanks for correcting my missing publisher info fields. Here is the newest one. Piano Quintet in C minor, Op.1 (Ferdinand, Prince Louis of Prussia) Could you please check to see if these are filled out correctly. I looked at the ones you fixed and tried to do the same formating. I hope I am in the right direction. Does it look OK? Thanks. Generoso 19:12, 18 July 2007 (EDT)

My pages get deleted

Hi Peter, I am relatively new here, and want to contribute. However over the last week 5 of the pages I have created have been deleted. There is no indication as to why or by who, nothing in my email or on my watchlist. For all I know there might have been a file that is copyrighted or something, but I would at least expect to be notified somehow. Otherwise it highly demotivates to continue contributing. These are the pages:

1. Concerto for 2 Mandolins, Strings and Basso Continuo, R 532 (Vivaldi, Antonio)
2. D.941 - Allegro in a for piano duet (also known as Lebensstürme) (Schubert, Franz)
3. D.957 N°04 - Ständchen (serenade)
4. ‎Fantasy for Two Pianos (Scriabin, Alexander)
5. Sonata in Eb minor (1889) (Scriabin, Alexander)

I saw that standchen was moved. Also saw that the Deutch number on Allegro for piano duet was wrong, however there is no link from 947. The others I have no clue. Is there a way to find out why and by who my pages dissappear? Would it not be normal for a watchlist to hold an entry if the watched page is being deleted?

On the contrary, I accidently tried to create a page with an ampersand in the name, maybe the forms should have some validation on them..., and then marked them for deletion by adding {{delete|reason}} like i read somewhere here i should do. These pages contrary to expectation don't get deleted...?

Like Concerto_for_2_Mandolins,_Strings_&_Basso_Continuo_(Vivaldi,_Antonio) and Concerto_for_2_Mandolins,_Strings_&_Basso_Continuo,_R_532_(Vivaldi,_Antonio)

What is going wrong?

greets Naja 08:03, 22 July 2007 (EDT)

Hi, Peter, for answer please check my talk page...Naja 10:14, 24 July 2007 (EDT)

Bach's Concerto BWV 1044

Dear Peter, thanks for the score of the BWV1044 (though I have it already on paper ) I'd like to know if it is possible for you to share the separate parts of this concerto (vl, fl, harpsichord just to start). Do you know if it's possible to create them from your pdf file? myabe some OCR-like software can do the job?

I know of someone who printed out the score, cut up the pages, and pasted each instrument line on one page to use as parts. If you want to do this digitally you can extract the images and cut it up in an imaging program. Music OCR is pretty much impossible; not only is the accuracy very low (even with digitally generated score images), but it requires about the same amount of trouble as just cutting apart the image (you have to extract the parts and then fix up the formatting, which, as anyone who has done it knows, is a pain).
By the way, don't forget to sign your comment with four tildes (~~~~). Thanks! :) --Feldmahler 14:39, 28 July 2007 (EDT)
I would reply about the same :) --Peter talk 05:36, 29 July 2007 (EDT)

Copyright eigene Kompositionen

Hallo Peter,

ich bin Komponist und möchte gerne meine eigenen Kompositionen hochladen. Diese haben aber ein Copyright, werden aber zum kostenlosen Download angeboten. Die Noten sind wegen Aufführungen alle bei der GEMA gemeldet. Zum Teil sind die Noten auch im copy-us Verlag, der diese ebenfalls zum kostenlosen Download anbietet.

Habe ich die Möglichkeit, solche Noten hochzuladen?

Eine Liste meiner Kompositionen mit Partituren ist auf: die Seite des Verlags ist

Herzlichen Dank für die Auskunft, Gregor

Hi. I forwarded your message to Leonard Vertighel, because my German writing is not so fluent! --Peter talk 05:09, 7 August 2007 (EDT)

Just to make sure that I don't reply some nonsense: Am I right in assuming that he can use Performance Restricted Attribution Non-commercial No Derivatives 1.0 for his works, just like Irgmaier did? --Leonard Vertighel 05:50, 7 August 2007 (EDT)

I think that is the best license that comes near his demands, but at the end, the author has the freedom to choose one of the licenses available on IMSLP. However, I think that a full copyright notice to this Copy-us Verlag, as in his scores, is incompatible with publication on IMSLP. Maybe you should ask him to take responsibility that Copy-us Verlag agrees with distribution of the works, or to remove the copyright notice? Cheers Peter talk 06:07, 7 August 2007 (EDT)


Thank you so much for uploading all those Joseph Hofmann scores! You wouldn't, I suppose, have the Mignonettes as well, would you? Best, Christiaan

I have uploaded most of the Hofmann scores from the Copenhagen royal library. Maybe you will find a score of Mignonettes there. You can find the link to this website on IMSLP:Links. Greetings Peter talk 05:43, 18 August 2007 (EDT)

Gregorian Chants

Hi! I have obtained few scores-books with gregorian chant melodies: Liber Usualis, Graduale, Vesperale, Antiphonale and so on. I think the best way is to upload it to category: medieval, but I don't know i. e. what to write as "author". If you have any suggestions, let me know!

Error in Bach-Ausgabe file

Hello, I just wanted to report a small error in a PDF-file of Band 39 of the BGA : There's the page 289 instead of page 257 (at p. 83 of the file). --Pierre.chepelov 17:09, 26 August 2007 (EDT)

Beethoven Triple Concerto - Cello Parts

are not downloadable. i think the pdf's are broken :( can someone please fix?


I`m Jakub Kowalewski

September - January

Yuri Shaporin

Hi, Peter. Do you happen to know if Schirmer failed to submit an NIE for this Soviet composer? While Muzgiz editions of older works are generally fair game, publications of contemporary composers active in the Soviet era are nearly all "restored" in the USA thanks to provisions of the GATT/TRIPs amendments to the copyright law. I'm going to mark this one under "copyright review" for the time being until we can determine the status. Thanks, Carolus 17:15, 3 September 2007 (EDT)


Dear Peter, As for that star, I just wanted a joke. Sorry, excuse me...Maurice nuit 06:47, 14 September 2007 (EDT)

Copyright Review project

Hi Peter! I just wanted to say that I've put up an initial draft of the Copyright Review page, and you can find it here: IMSLP:Copyright Reviewers. :) There are currently three copyright reviewers who have passed the test: pml, Hobbypianist, and Matthieu. Maybe you can greet them, and tell them about this page? :) --Feldmahler 14:57, 30 September 2007 (EDT)

P.S. Of course feel free to add to this page, since its just an initial draft :)

OK --Peter talk 16:00, 30 September 2007 (EDT)
  • Thanks for the message Peter – I'm just about to have a look at the page :) Philip Legge @ © Φ 21:16, 30 September 2007 (EDT)

Tables with plate numbers

Hi Peter, a question concerning the helpful lists with plate numbers. I haven't made entries there so far since you and Carolus seem to have the overview :) But I plan to do it, too, so I just wanted to know your system: not all uploaded scores with explicitly mentioned dates have an entry. Do you only add scores with 'interesting' dates/years which are not yet in the list? Of course, keeping all the lists up to date/record each score would take up a lot of time, that's impossible! I think I'll add only editions with a clear indication of the date/year. What would you recommend, what's your method? Hobbypianist 04:52, 2 October 2007 (EDT)

Err... it's rather based on time and randomly decided ... Mostly, only plates with proof of date are added, and the most interesting deserve priority: the Durand picture is rather clear by now, but the Schuberth isn't. But there isn't really a system. There was recently an effort to automatize the tables using a Publisher template, but it's not running smoothly. Peter talk 06:12, 2 October 2007 (EDT)
yes, I've already seen some of the templates. It would be great if one could choose a publisher for example from a drop-down list during the submission of a file and the system made the rest automatically. Inserting it manually afterwards is more editing work :) Hobbypianist 09:54, 3 October 2007 (EDT)
Actually, I'm working exactly on such a thing :) Expect it within the near future. Will probably be done when I fix up the add composer/work/file special pages (which are lagging way behind the templates themselves). --Feldmahler 11:47, 3 October 2007 (EDT)

Copyright review criterions for living composers

Hi Peter,
and thank you for the welcome message to new copyright reviewers you left on my discussion page. I have discovered for a couple of days the hidden side of IMSLP and the amount of work it represents besides submitting scores ! (Useless to mention that I don't regret). I have a question related to living composers: I am quite puzzled by some contributions whose submitter seems to be the composer himself (while it is hard to prove), or someone else whose relation to the composer is not obvious. The scores themselves often do not contain any copyright information or explicit mention to a licence, while the work is tagged with a CC licence but again with no proof that it is the composer himself who gave this licence. What are the habits of accustomed reviewers ? In which case should we use checked/verified or tag with a "FilenotPD" ?
Best regards,
Matthieu 09:50, 3 October 2007 (EDT)

Hi. For new composers, I always ask on the talk page of the submitter whether they are the composer. Usually, for some reason, most people don't manage to answer this simple question, or they don't know how to reply. If they are the composer, they must put this on their user page. I also ask if they are sure that the license on IMSLP is the one they want, especially in the case they entered public domain as license. And indeed, it is on my mind for a long time that all these composers should better make mention of the license in the pdf itself instead of leaving no traces on their scores, but I must admit I haven't managed to systematically ask this or the make this into guideline. Cheers --Peter talk 14:37, 3 October 2007 (EDT)

2L Electronic Scores

The reason I uploaded this score was that it said this on their web site. 2L Scores Web site

The music published by 2L Electronic Scores is free to be downloaded, distributed and printed. Commercial rights and public performance is worldwide protected by CISAC and its national associates. Its Norwegian representative is TONO. In other words; These scores are free for you to obtain and prepare.

But you can decide if it ok or not on IMSLP. Generoso 07:21, 10 October 2007 (EDT)

Multi-file template

Hi there Peter! The multifile template that you requested is now online ;) Please see the changelog for more information, and about how to use it. --Feldmahler 11:42, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

Urtext editions and RoST

Hi Peter, just dropping you a line to let you know there's been some more discussion of this issue over at the IMSLP:Grand Wiki Cleanup page. Carolus 02:41, 3 November 2007 (EDT)

Hi again, Peter. For Archive des Maitres de l'Orgue (Guilmant, Félix Alexandre), I think it's safe to assert that it's an urtext-style edition - which means the whole thing is almost certainly free in the EU along wit being free in Canada and the USA. Editor death dates (like Pirro's in 1943) matter only when the editor has actually made significant changes or additions to the original material - or if we've reproduced the editorial notes, prefaces (which appear to all be by Guilmant in this case), etc. Carolus 14:45, 10 December 2007 (EST)

New Copyright Tagger

Hi Peter! Can you give me your opinions on this: IMSLP:Grand_Wiki_Cleanup#New_Copyright_Tagger. Thanks :) --Feldmahler 23:52, 5 November 2007 (EST)

French plate numbers with G.H.

Hi Peter, The Godard piece was most likely first issued by Georges Hartmann, who was active from about 1870 until he sold the company to Heugel in the 1890s. Nice addition! Carolus 17:06, 6 January 2008 (EST)


February - June

Variations on 'Yankee Doodle', Op.6 (Mason, Daniel)

Hi Peter, I had a look at the recently uploaded works and saw that you mentioned the name of the company which sells scanned music. Have the guidelines been changed meanwhile? I was not regularly online here, so maybe I'm not up to date. Regards, Hobbypianist 14:02, 19 March 2008 (EDT)

You got me there ;) I remember vaguely there has been talking about, but guidelines surely haven't been changed. --Peter talk 12:50, 20 March 2008 (EDT)


Hi Peter, Klindworth was professor of piano at the Moscow Conservatory from 1868-1881, which coincides with the publication of his Chopin edition. The Jurgenson printing (which was issued 1873-76 I've now discovered) was almost certainly a simultaneous issue with that of Bote & Bock in Berlin. (Ha, not really. Bote had to wait until 1879 or 1880 as Chopin was under copyright in Germany until then.) I don't know if they were using the same engraving or not. Klindworth certainly had dealings with Western publishers in that period, notably with respect to his creation of vocal-piano scores for the Wagner operas for Schott. At any rate, it will certainly be useful to have all the info about this (and other) Chopin editions - for which we thank you! Carolus 14:47, 23 March 2008 (EDT)

Hi again, I don't know if those editions posted by Feldmahler of the Etudes, Opp.10 and 25 are Bote & Bock prints or Augener. They look like very much like the other Augeners I've seen but I don't know if Augener just reprinted Bote, or if both Bote and Augener actually reprinted the Jurgenson and merely changed the order of things. I seem to recall reading somewhere that the Bote issue was one that had been revised by Klindworth. That doesn't mean it was actually re-engraved, though. The engraving itself is not characteristic of Röder, who was responsible for the vast majority of Bote's output in that era. The engraving itself looks somewhat like Jurgenson's production of the period, but the typeface used for titles, etc, does not. Carolus 02:41, 27 March 2008 (EDT)

Thanks for the link to the Polish National Library site. The Augener is definitely a reprint of the Bote & Bock. I wouldn't be at all surprised if Scharwenka's revision of Klindworth's edition consisted solely of the presence of his name. That's how Augener could have claimed a copyright in England of the day (1880), since the Berne treaty didn't yet exist. They are definitely the same engraving, which I have now confirmed is quite different from the Jurgenson issue. Carolus 01:45, 29 March 2008 (EDT)

OK, I see your point about the Scherzo - they appear to be different engravings by the same engraver (one 12 pages, the other 14). I just read the Wikipedia bio on Scharwenka, who evidently resided in Berlin and was renowned as a Chopin interprter. I expect that Bote & Bock published both the Klindworth and Klindworth/Scharwenka editions, while Augener issued a licensed reprint of Klindworth/Scharwenka. Klindworth/Scharwenka may have appeared as early as 1880, but 1882-1885 seems more likely. Klindworth himself moved back to Germany in 1881, so there might be later revisions on his part as well. There are so many editions of Chopin that one could almost run a separate IMSLP-Chopin. Publishers sometimes issued as many as 4 separate "complete editions" at the same time. We'll eventually unravel at least some of the confusion (hopefully). Carolus 14:13, 29 March 2008 (EDT)

Chopin Schirmer eds.

Hi again Peter, Schirmer published three seperate editions of Chopin's piano works: Mikuli, Joseffy and Friedheim. For Mikuli, I think they may have reprinted the Kistner & Siegel engravings in the late 1800s and (perhaps) re-engraved them fresh in the 1930s. I've seen plate numbers in the 10,000s and in the 30,000s which name Mikuli as editor. I've not really done a detailed examination to determine this supposition, though. As I understand it, there are around 150 complete editions of the Chopin piano works that have been prepared since his death in 1849, which is probably the greatest number of any composer. There were multiple editions of numerous works in several countries in the composer's own lifetime, which are contradictory in some details. Chopin is probably a musicologist's worst nightmare in many respects. Carolus 15:30, 23 March 2008 (EDT)

Beethoven: Piano Trio, Op.38

Hi Peter, This item looks like it was originally produced in the 1870s or 1880s. It is not at all characteristic of Röder's production from 1915 or thereabouts. What, if anything, did Paul Grümmer's supposed editorship consist of here (assuming it is even the score he allegedly edited)? This is an example of the type of thing Peters is absolutely notorious for - reprinting an old 1870s score of Carl Hermann, sticking a new name as "editor" along with a new copyright notice. I note that there is no editorial claim of any type on the first page of the score posted here. Carolus 20:20, 3 April 2008 (EDT)

The score is part of the complete piano trios. the worldcat entry cites: "von L. van Beethoven ; neue ausgabe mit fingersätzen von Carl Herrmann und Paul Grümmer." Grummer was a cellist, and these fingerings are not apparent in the score, so the score is indeed in public domain.--Peter talk 05:33, 4 April 2008 (EDT)

OK, it appears the cello part as edited by Grummer is off-limits. At least that's understandable. Peters has a long history of sticking names on scores just to make a copyright claim. I just had a rather lengthy e-mail exchange with a German music dealer about this issue. He complained to me that this very annoying practice has spread to several other publishers who hadn't indulged in it before - especially Breitkopf. At some point, we're going to have to set up a place on the work pages where measure-by-measure comparisons of the sometimes bewildering number of different editions can be posted. Carolus 02:24, 9 April 2008 (EDT)

Schubert Complete Works Edition

Hi Peter,

Congratulations on your recent Schubert contributions!

I have a dream... (with apologies to Martin Luther King ;-)) see every single one of the numbers in the Deutsch-listing linked to a page with at least one score on it.

Well, all right, maybe not the ones listed as "lost".

It is always a huge pleasure when someone else also contributes. (trying to work full-time as well as stop the house degenerating into a squalid state, providing church music and helping to run the choir, playing in a piano trio with my friends and being official Schubert-Lieder-accompanist to my work colleague the amateur baritone, and trying to convince my husband that I don't love the computer more than him, all does not leave much spare time for scanning and uploading!)

And you managed to find the "Marches Characteristiques!" You have read my mind. The very same week that a copy of same arrived in the mail, thanks to EBay (a very old C.F. Peters score, ed. S. Jadassohn, plate 5409). Oh well, it looks like now there will be two versions.

Don't worry about doubling up on me - I would much rather see that, than seeing works missing. But just one request - leave the Arpeggione Sonata for me (it's on my scanning queue on the "to do soon" list - it's a piece I have a long and affectionate association with, and holds a special sentimental value.) Something to do with an alto flute, and many hours spent rewriting and transcribing, and then practicing.

Keep up the good work! --Aldona 19:13, 6 April 2008 (EDT)

The Arpeggione? Sweeeeeeet... Don't worry, I don't have any copies, and I didn't encounter it on bh2000. But No! I'll upload every possible version I can find , especially for viola... Apparently, most of Feldmahlers initial uploads, which he got from filesharing, seem to come from bh2000, like the Schubert works. But some works seem just to be forgotten, like the Marches Characteristiques.
Oh, and again: your scanning work is just fantastic. At reopening, IMSLP shall be proud that it's the only website with the complete schubert lieder.
Peter talk 11:19, 7 April 2008 (EDT)
Oh, it just came to me that we'll need to split the Schubert Complete page soon. --Peter talk 11:29, 7 April 2008 (EDT)

Gesammtausgabe templates

Hi Peter, Thank you very much for creating these templates - they make life considerably easier when adding publication info! The only suggestion I'd like to make is that you consider using the short form of the series name:, e.g. " Wolfgang Amadeus Mozarts Werke" instead of " Wolfgang Amadeus Mozarts Werke: Kritische Durchgesehene Gesammtausgabe" in the template itself, and mention only the series number itself instead of spelling out the sometimes lengthy series title. The templates already link the user to the special page for the given Gesammtausgabe, where the full title, individual section or series titles, etc. are presented in detail. I think you already used the 'short form' for Schumann, which I think makes for a cleaner, more concise publisher citation. BTW, I think Google books has the actual critcial report for the Schubert Gesammtausgabe posted, which might be a nice download to add to that Gesammtausgabe page (if one can get rid of all the Google logos, etc.) Carolus 02:15, 9 April 2008 (EDT)

That is a good remark. The reason that I was not too consequent in both the title of the edition pages and the title in the templates is because we don't have a consensus the title. I also was not sure whether a short title would be specific for one edition (e.g. Chopin Complete Works or Klavierwerke). So:
  1. in the publication template, I concur to using a short version of the title in original language. The rest of the publication info is sufficient to identify the edition.
  2. which title will we use for the edition pages ? We have all sorts of forms now. They should contain specific information to prevent confusion between the different complete editions - we already have two brahms, two schubert and three liszt complete editions. --Peter talk 12:30, 9 April 2008 (EDT)

I see what you're talking about when I look at the edition page! The names are all over the place. I expect the best thing would be to use the pattern found in Mozart with the vast majority of the Gesammtausgabe, with the possible exception of the Bach Gesellschaft Ausgabe, which is widely known by that name in the English-speaking world. The issue becomes knottier with some of the select editions. I'll check the Heyer book (Historical Sets, Collected Editions and Monuments of Music) at my local university library to see what, if anything, she came up with as a means of handling the nomenclature. Carolus 22:43, 9 April 2008 (EDT)

Antiquated German words

Hi Peter, there are lots of old-fashioned German words in the listings of Beethoven, Mozart... Gesamtausgabe Editions, like Violoncell (Violoncello), or variirt (variiert), Concert (Konzert), Gesammtausgabe (Gesamtausgabe), capitalization of nouns (Mozart) etc. Shouldn't they be adapted to modern German spelling or is this intended? Well, as native speaker for me it just looked a bit weird... Let me know if I should correct it. Regards, Hobbypianist 12:44, 12 April 2008 (EDT)

Well, I was not aware of that (Belgians have only a very basic knowledge of German, although it's an official language:p). I have copied the table of contents from library catalogues as is, because of historical interest. Sometimes other titles were in use than nowadays, or other opus numbers. So maybe it's more correct to leave the original version, if needed with a notice? If it's too unreadable, of course, feel free to change the spelling. --Peter talk 04:48, 13 April 2008 (EDT)
It's absolute readable, any speaker of German will recognize this as it's ok (but it should be avoided to use these expressions in page titles). Nevertheless, I'll make some capitalization on the Mozart page, this is really necessary :-) Hobbypianist 14:41, 14 April 2008 (EDT)

Thank you for the new Schubert template!

I have tried it and it works beautifully (see "Widerspruch", D.865). After I have used it once, it will automatically appear as a prompt when I start to enter info into the "add a file" template, and it will be even quicker and easier to plug numbers into.

I am still obsessively scouring EBay/Amazon and all the secondhand book and music sites I can for those little yellow Kalmus scores, but the supply is starting to dry up a bit. Hopefully more will come out of the woodwork.

How are your medical studies going? We are always looking for more doctors at our clinic. ;-) In fact, acquiring one who can play the viola would be like winning the lottery. We already have a piano (me), violin and cello, and one of the GP's a couple of suburbs away plays the double bass. Once you join us, that is the full complement for the "Trout" quintet!

Time to go to work, may not have time to upload much for the next few days.

Aldona 17:45, 15 April 2008 (EDT)

Well, if you can offer me a position in otolaryngology, I'm on my way to come play the Trout - however it would be hard not playing the piano in the variations :) Where are you located? You work as a GP? Currently, i'm finishing my last (seventh) medical year, after which I'll start as otolaryngology trainee.
By the way, you know good second hand sheet music websites?--Peter talk 08:40, 16 April 2008 (EDT)

Was halfway through a detailed reply with lots of secondhand music websites and then lost it - will try again tonight! Yes, I'm a humble GP in the far outer east of Melbourne. our area was featured in the Melbourne newspapers a little while back as an example of an "area of medical need", with the lowest doctor:population ratio in the Melbourne metropolitan area. Yesterday at work was an absolute nightmare and just when I think it can't get any more hectic it does. (and it's not even a full moon yet.) I wasn't going to do any scanning as I had too much other stuff to do, but when I got home I was so brain-dead that I couldn't get my head around anything else and only had an hour to kill until it was time to get some sleep. Thus another four D-numbers on the Schubert Works list now have works linked to them...

Off to work again, will hopefully be back tonight with more if the patients let me.

Aldona 17:39, 16 April 2008 (EDT)

A bit of housekeeping in the Schubert section

Can I enlist your help as a fellow Schubertian (as I don't have the power to delete files)?

I have just re-scanned and re-uploaded Fischerlied (D.364, male quartet). The old file (which I scanned and submitted almost a year ago to the day, interestingly) needs to be removed as it is now a duplicate. I think it was the very first file I ever uploaded to IMSLP. (My scanning skills have improved a bit since those early days, I would hope...;-))

Keep up the good work!

Aldona 21:42, 24 April 2008 (EDT)

Reply to IRC question

Hi there Peter!

Just to reply to the question you posted on IRC: there is no "remarkable" news, but the process is continuing as usual. We are currently trying to sort out a few small technical legal issues, but otherwise everything is going fine :) The projected date that I told you still very much holds. --Feldmahler 22:48, 3 May 2008 (EDT)

Rule of the Shorter Term - USA, EU, Russia/USSR

Hi Peter, I responded to your very good point about this issue over at my talk page. I now think we should tag all the works like the Godowsky examples mentioned in our previous discussion as "checked" for the EU as there is a high likelihood that they are indeed free in the EU thanks to RoST. Carolus 16:41, 11 May 2008 (EDT)

Hi Peter, I was wondering what your opinion on this Wikipedia article was. It looks to me that the new Russian law extends the life-plus-70 term to all authors who died after 1942. That would include composers like Myaskovsky and Rachmaninoff, of course. This effects the status of such works in the EU since they would not be public domain in Russia, the country of origin in most cases. Rachmaninoff's country of origin is quite complicated because be beame a US citizen a few months before he died, which is ultimately why all the early works first issued after his death in the USSR are free in the USA - as a US citizen his works are not eligible for GATT/TRIPs restoration. This should not have any effect on the status of Russian composers under Canada's law, only the EU. Carolus 17:57, 6 June 2008 (EDT)


Hi Peter, I noticed that you've uploaded some of Ibert's works. How are we able to host these on the IMSLP Canadian server if they're not PD in at least Canada? If this is legit. then I would have TONS of things to upload that fit the same bill. Daphnis 10:00, 25 May 2008 (EDT)

Regarding Ibert again, should we go ahead and remove the 4 uploads as well as remove the composer page? (Also check me on the Wolf-Ferrari issue. And also btw, that scan is mine :) I guess someone I sent it to a while back did some re-circulation on the internet) Daphnis 08:57, 20 June 2008 (EDT)

Hi Peter, I just noticed that there is a "" watermark on the Muzgiz score of the Beethoven "Ghost" Trio that you uploaded. While this is not an obvious trademark, we might want to be a little cautious because it could be trademarked and their files typically have a "Copying this file is illegal" header (also done as a watermark). While there is no legal basis for any claim to copyright on scans of public domain scores like this one in either Canada or the USA, that might not be the case in parts of the EU. If there were an easy way to remove the watermark, that might be best to do so for now. If they are difficult to get rid of, I think we might wish to talk it over with Feldmahler, since I expect we'll be in for some more nasty letters once we go up again on July 1. Henle, BTW, was very diligent about renewing all their copyrights in the USA. You should tag their urtext editions as either "unknown" or "non-PD" for the US. They should be fine for both Canada and the EU as long as they are over 25 years old.


Hi there Peter; this is just a heads up about the news entry I posted today on the main page :) --Feldmahler 16:07, 5 June 2008 (EDT)

Royal composers: Correct format of name

Just wondering what your thoughts are on the best way to set out the names of members of royalty who were composers (and who don't follow the usual rules about names and surnames that the rest of us peasants do.)

I notice that Prince Louis Ferdinand of Prussia already has a page, although his name comes out a little awkwardly as "Prince Louis of Prussia Ferdinand" on the page.

The two I am interesting in potentially adding are:

  • King Friedrich II (The Great) of Prussia (1712-1786) - was an avid flute player, employed people like Quantz and C.P.E. Bach, and was responsible for writing a lot of flute music himself.
  • Albert, Prince Consort (Husband of Queen Victoria) (1819-1861)- was an amateur musician and friend of Mendelssohn, and there is a collection of his works on the Sibley website.

If only kings and princes would concentrate on running the country and not dabble in music, we wouldn't have this dilemma... Aldona 19:55, 9 June 2008 (EDT)

Hmm... I think the most important in the formatting of the name is how you want the users to find the composer, so I would place the name that is most commonly used in front. e.g. Friedrich II the Great, King of Prussia ? The make it even more complex, these royalties had the habit of naming everyone after each other, and I learned that there are in fact three Princes Louis Ferdinand of Prussia. I think most people would try to look him up as Louis Ferdinand, Prince of Prussia? --Peter talk 03:08, 10 June 2008 (EDT)
I have moved the latter Prince to his new category. --Peter talk 05:32, 10 June 2008 (EDT)
Most of the library entries I've seen use the following format: Louis Ferdinand I, Prince of Prussia (xxxx-xxxx) or Henry VIII, King of England (a composer along with the many other activities for which he is more (in)famous). It also gets awkward when a composer is awarded an honorary title, as in Sullivan, Arthur Seymour (Sir). I'm no librarian, but that's what I run into when I'm cruising around OCLC looking for info to blow some phony copyright claim out of the water. Carolus 13:37, 10 June 2008 (EDT)


New users

Hi Peter, It appears that new user Caprotti has uploaded a number of replacement files for things we already have, inclding some previously submitted by Goldberg988 whose scans are usually of very high quality. Should he be doing this? I already had to zap a number of files from one new user (who has not read our copyright guidelines, etc.) and wanted to check with you to see if these replacements were OK or not. I've also noticed that these PDF files he's submitting fail to open all the way when I try to look at them. Thanks, Carolus 19:07, 1 July 2008 (EDT)

I can relate to your feelings!! How difficult can the guidelines be to understand? The deletions I did today were for two reasons: 1) a new edition, arrangement or typeset that was not created by the person who uploaded it (as far as I could tell), which is a potential copyright problem; 2) an exact duplicate (the identical file) of something already in the archive. Yes, I still use the yahoo e-mail account, so I'll reply there as well. OK, I read his e-mail and your reply. I have no problem with him wanting to replace the scans, though there is no protection for a library stamp or watermark attached to a scan of a public domain original in either Canada or the USA. The only (slight) issue I can think of is the fact that any of the files we've just certified as being public domain suddenly revert to unknown status when they are replaced. I light of the fact that we still have a fairly significant (ca.4500) number of files to go through and review, the prospect of Caprotti do all of this right now is less than ideal. Perhaps this should be organized as a community project. It would also be nice to credit Caprotti as the scanner, since (as you mentioned) we hardly ever know who has scanned what. I've also wondered about requiring additional identification on things from uploaders, especially page counts and publisher info. Carolus, 1 July 2008 (EDT)
I agree he should better start uploading his new files instead of all those old files, but he does not seem to get how to do it - Italians were never good in English which is probably the source of all the problems. I suppose the Score Submission Guide has the highest priority in updating and translating the documentation.
It is not the right moment for reviewing every new version of an existing file he would upload, but I do like the configuration in which new versions of existing files get a new tag - this way, I have already fished out some totally wrong uploads which otherwise would get no attention at all. --Peter talk 07:59, 2 July 2008 (EDT)

Regarding Danish translation

Hi Peter, I will be doing my best to keep the Danish translation updated - I can't promise more than that. I will be monitoring the English versions of all pages I translate and update them asap, but I can't always promise to have a translation ready within a day of updates. Hope this is good enough. Best regards, Andreas talk

Haydn, Joseph - 3 Piano Trios, Hob.XV:9-10 (Op.27)

Hello Peter, Nice to see this site up and running again. BTW the 3 Piano Trios, Hob.XV:9-10 (Op.27) (Haydn, Joseph) does not open after I downloaded it. I noticed that you uploaded it and perhaps there is something wrong with the file. I just thought I would let you know. Thanks -- Generoso

Weird, I can download it perfectly. Have you tried clearing your browser cache? (see also the older news via the home page). --Peter talk 17:46, 3 July 2008 (EDT)
Strange, I downloaded it again and it opens great! It must be a problem on my side. Thanks again.Generoso

instrument lists

Yes, these lists are very helpful to find pieces. I too, have tried out many different combinations. What do you think of the one on the cello page now? It seems to be clearer than other. What is your opinion? I just changed them all. and it seems once the info is in they are quite easy to change format although it does take some time.Generoso

Tchaikovsky Cello Concerto

My completion is based on the sketches to the work, kindly supplied by Brett Langston. YuriyLcello 11:53, 6 July 2008 (EDT)

Bruch Double Concerto

Hi Peter, I have a question about this. If Germany and EU Copyright give a 70-year term after publication for works first published in the term of protection following a composer's death, this work should theoretically be under full copyright until 2013 - just as you have tagged it. Why, then, does the Bavarian State Library have this available for free viewing over at their site? Perhaps there is an exemption for libraries and archives under the German / EU statutes, but if that's so why then aren't all of the more modern items like Bartok, Schoenberg, etc. likewise present in their digital collection?

While the publication is dated (on the title page), it was published without a copyright notice and would be public domain in the USA unless Eichmann or their successor filed an NIE in the two-year window of 1996-98. Nevertheless, we probably should leave it tagged as Non-PD US until some research is done. Carolus 12:11, 7 July 2008 (EDT)

Maybe they just made an error at the Bavarian State Library? The librarians are human after all. Or we can ask them. --Peter talk 12:21, 7 July 2008 (EDT)
You know, I've been re-reading the EU directive and the German and UK law, and I actually can't find the protection of 70years post-pub if posthumously published within the copyright term. They only talk about the 25-year protection if published after the copyright term of the author. But I might have read over it. --Peter talk 12:32, 7 July 2008 (EDT)

That's interesting. I noticed that Denmark's law is that way when I looked it up for the dabte over at the forum about Canto Serioso. I know that Canada starts the clock running at 50 years from date of publication if the work is published within the 50-year window, I thought that most laws that were based on the Berne Treaty's life-plus XX years rubric worked that way. Guess we'll need to do some more study in our copious spare time! Carolus 13:33, 7 July 2008 (EDT)

I just looked over both the EU statute, the 93/98 Directive, and the German law itself (in the English translation linked from Wikipedia) and cannot find anything that indicates a work published within the 70-year window after the last surviving author's death is protected for any longer than works published within an author's lifetime. If that is indeed the case, this Bruch piece would be public domain in the USA as well because Bruch had enetered the German and EU public domain on 1/1/1991. Carolus 13:48, 7 July 2008 (EDT)

Copyright Review Instructions

Hi Peter, Excellent work - and thank you very much for this. It is greatly appreciated. I'd like to make a couple of minor changes in the last section:

  1. Typesets are digitalisations [this word is confusing, as "digitalization" can mean the scanning of an old score and coversion to a TIFF or PDF file. I would use "computer re-engravings" instead.] of certain editions. The work that is being digitized [has been re-engraved] should be in public domain too. In most cases, you will not [need to] identify the source publication. This is not a big problem, as the responsibility lies with the typesetter. In rare cases the typeset is a new or a critical edition made by the typesetter.
  2. Look for the name of typesetter. Is there one on the score? Is it the uploader? Contact them, and invite them to make theirself public on their user page. 99% of the typesetters are active on Mutopia or WIMA.
  3. Typesets are for practical purposes regarded as new editions, even if there is no editorial addition by the typesetter. [The typesetter should therefore be listed as the editor, even if it is merely a re-engraving of an older edition. By virtue of the fact that the music was enetered into a computer notation program, the person doing it becomes an editor since it is impossible to exactly duplicate a plate engraving with notational programs like Finale, Sibelius, Lilypond, and others.]
  4. [If the typeset originated at Mutopia or a similar site, that site should be listed as publisher, since making a file available for distribution - even if at no charge - constitutes "publication" according to the legal definition of the term in many countries. Otherwise, the typesetter/editor shoudl be listed as publisher.]
  5. If details are known, and the typesetter grants permission to distribute his scores, tag N!/N!/N!
  6. If nothing is known, you can tag C/C/C, releasing the file on the website. The typesetter can always id himself and ask for removal of the file. [The exception to this rule is for files which origibnally come from WIMA, who generally opposes re-distribution of typesets from their site.]

Yes sure go ahead, a hereby release that page in public domain :)) --Peter talk 07:55, 9 July 2008 (EDT)

Question about your uploads

Hello Peter, I wanted to ask you if those two uploads of yours should acutally remain on IMSLP:

And while I'm here, could you please explain to me what the CR tag '!N/!N/!N' means, and why the piece Invention (Pétronio, Arthur) is declared PD, rather than being released under a CC license? Thank you, --Leonard Vertighel 05:49, 10 July 2008 (EDT)

Yes, my US-only files can be deleted, I uploaded them when I was not fully aware which would be allowed now. Don't worry I'll do it for you.  !N is Not in Public Domain but Permission Granted -- see User_talk:Carolus/archive5#Permission_Granted. Public domain is indeed not allowed for typesets. P.S. You're no copyright reviewer ?? --Peter talk 05:58, 10 July 2008 (EDT)

Frederic Rzewski


I tried to contact Frederic Rzewski but the email address I have seems to be out of date. Its probably best if you delete the additions until we know more. kind regards Helohe 19:05, 11 July 2008 (EDT)

Possible scores

Hi Peter,
Thank you for fixing my countertenor template. I'm new to this whole wiki thing, and just sorting things out when I have free moments. I had a question for you about Brahms scores. I noticed you have Brahms lieder on your to-do list. I would love to take a look at the scores for Vier ernsten Gesänge, Op. 121 and Zwei Gesänge, Op. 91. If you've got them, it would be really great if you could share. No big deal if not. I've got Op. 121 on order from my local library. That's the opus I'm really interested in right now. Anyway thanks for your help. let me know if there's anything I could do for you.
Till later, Steven

Tchaikovsky Tempest score incomplete

Hi Peter,

just wanted to note that page 62 and page 91 of the Tempest score (wonderful piece) are blank. Perhaps someone else has a complete version?

best, mhurshell

I can't do much about it - it's from bh2000. Peter talk 09:03, 15 July 2008 (EDT)

A pity. Perhaps one should include a comment on the score page, about the missing pages. mhurshell

Translation to Catalan

Hi! Sure, I'll update the main page as soon as I can, as well as the other important pages (I'm having a bit of trouble with work, but I'll finish soon). --Gerardpc 16:47, 15 July 2008 (EDT)

Chinese Rhapsody

This work was finished in Kostanai, Kazakhstan (part of USSR) in April 1945 and first published in Moscow immediately after his arrival in the Kremlin Hospital. Since Xian died before 1953 and this work was composed and first published in Russia (along his other works composed in Russia / Kazakhstan), his works should be in the public domain. This work was reprinted by the Peoples' Publishing House (Government owned) in 1951, which this work is scanned from.


Please help!

Hi -

I'm trying yo upload my extensive collection of sheet music in piano reduction of the scores of the composer Cesare Pugni, all written for the ballet. I have a large collection of extremely rare items. I also have several other rare sheet music of music for the Imperial ballet of St. Petersburg by such composers as Drigo and Minkus.

In my attempt to share with the site I registered with Adobe acrobat reader at this web page - this is my page

After that, I have no idea about what to do, and the adobe forums are confusing.

Does the sheet music I upload have to be in this format? -

If so could you please help me, or direct me to someone who can help create such a file?

I would very much like to share my extensive collection with everyone!

--MrLopez2681 08:43, 21 July 2008 (EDT)

I see you have put your question in the IMSLP forum - that's the right place for such questions! --Peter talk 09:38, 21 July 2008 (EDT)
OH YES - but thatk you anyway - I got it figured out! --MrLopez2681 21:01, 22 July 2008 (EDT)

Capitalisations in titles

Hello Peter. I notice you've just altered the titles of Tchaikovsky's "The Voyevoda, opera, Op.3" and "The Voyevoda, melodrama" so that the words "opera" and "melodrama" have initial capitals restored. As these words don't form part of the title proper, but are required for disambiguation purposes, I understood that lower case should be used, as they have been in other instances (such as the Hamlet incidental music and the duet from Romeo and Juliet). Are there guidelines to follow in such cases? Thanks P.davydov 09:55, 22 July 2008 (EDT)

Many thanks for the quick response. I guess I'm just used to cataloging that way, with initial capitals for titles and lower case for everything else. Would you mind if I changed those two back to the lower-case versions, if only for the sake of consistency with the other entries on the page? P.davydov 13:17, 22 July 2008 (EDT)

Recent additions

The german version "Kürzlich hinzugefügt" still only shows this older version:

  • Handel: L'Allegro, il Penseroso, ed il Moderato, HWV 55 (#18743)
  • Cui: Angelo (8 files)
  • Handel: Athalia, HWV 52 (#18738)

I just recognized it, because there were no changes the last days. But the english and french version have counted to number 19247:

Recent additions

  • Massenet: Dors, ami (#19247)
  • Massenet: Chanson de Capri (#19246)
  • Gounod: Chants Sacres (#19245)

Maybe you know how to change this. Viele Grüße, Ahandrich 02:47, 23 July 2008 (EDT)

Oh, Wow, it just changed. Ahandrich 02:49, 23 July 2008 (EDT)

This depends on cache renewing on the server. This happens automatically after maximum 3 days, but you can purge the cache of the German homepage by typing &action=purge at the end of the url.--Peter talk 05:11, 23 July 2008 (EDT)

Alan Belkin

In response to your question, yes I am indeed he, or me ... :-) So, yes, I have been uploarding my own music.

Double Cello Concerto in G Minor, RV531

Hi Peter, What's your take on this? There is a continuo realization as part of the full score, so that is most likely off-limits. The real question concerns the string parts. They appear to be fairly heavily edited to my eye. Is it urtext or interpretative? Do the slurs and articualtions added by Malipiero constitute sufficiently original additions to qualify as a full derivative work copyright? How original is the continuo realization, really? These things can drive one crazy!! Carolus 16:49, 25 July 2008 (EDT)

I'm not extensively accustomed to baroque literature, but after comparison with other Vivaldi scores available, it seems to me that this is indeed an interpretative edition. In the other scores, there are no dynamics present with only occasionally a slur or articulation - everything which is added by the editor is included in brackets on the score. One could argue that these additions could reflect the result of scientific research, but in common performer's sense the aforementioned musical components are the key elements of an interpretation. As I assume there are no precedents in law of the use of the scientific edition paragraph in music printing, I think we should keep the interpretation of this law very strict and remove the double concerto. --Peter talk 06:18, 26 July 2008 (EDT)

How i translate pages?

Is the second time that i start to translate a page and have to be reverted, Can you help me?--Jcegobrain 11:35, 30 July 2008 (EDT)


I will read, thank you--Jcegobrain 16:08, 30 July 2008 (EDT)

aug-dec 2008

Hierarchy of Items on a Page

Hi Peter, I thought I should bring you in on the discussion of what IMSLP's official page hierarchy should be. Lyle Neff has raised the issue over at the forum. While I disagree with his proposed hierarchy, he has a point in that there is a need for one now that we are seeing so many orchestral parts being uploaded. I'll be giving Feldmahler a call on this as well so we can all hopefully come up with some ideas of what it should be and why it should be in a given order. Thanks, Carolus 17:52, 3 August 2008 (EDT)

Canons and Fugues for Piano (Klengel, Julius)

Peter, I could be wrong but I don't think Julius Klengel wrote these pieces. But actually they may have been written by Klengel, August Alexander. Thanks Generoso 04:11, 4 August 2008 (EDT)

Correct. I'll move it to the correct composer. --Peter talk 04:37, 4 August 2008 (EDT)

Please add Chinese language

I just translated the main page into Chinese (首页). Please add Chinese to the language list. Thanks! yuanyelele 03:25, 19 August 2008 (EDT)

Very nice! I have added the Chinese language to the Main page languages list, but there is a bug to be solved first before the language will be detected by the browser. That's why you correctly added zh to OtherLangs:Main Page within a comment.--Peter talk 03:47, 19 August 2008 (EDT)

Wieniawska-Paul-Poldowski whatever

Thank you for tidying up the composer name - I was wondering how best to do that - but it might cause a bit of confusion. The lady in question was usually known as Madame Poldowski (or usually just Poldowski). She was the daughter of Henryk Wieniawski but preferred to go by the pseudonym.

There are a couple of nice pictures of her at the following link that we could use for her composer page (but I'm far too blonde to know how to upload them).

Aldona 07:57, 26 August 2008 (EDT)

Roger Branga/Lucien Garban

Hi Peter, I was curious to know where you found out about this? It's a very curious piece of info. I'd like to hear more about if you have time. Thanks for correcting the copyright tags accordingly. Daphnis 18:38, 6 September 2008 (EDT)

On Orchestrators, Arrangers and Editors. I uploaded my own scan of the Bolero transcription in the beginning days of IMSLP, and I think it was Carolus who pointed this out. Peter talk 18:51, 6 September 2008 (EDT)
Ok, thanks for the info. We'll let it hang out until 2010 I guess. Daphnis 18:54, 6 September 2008 (EDT)

I'm sorry

I see how hard is to continue "help", but if you see had more than one page with this same name and i translate the second page with the link "portuguese", and if you see my contributions i'm not try to vandal or "delete" any page, but is realy dificult try to repair or continue what have been half done and left incompleted. Think about protect the pages in English, this will be more eficient than revert every mistake made, and only admin have permission to edit. In the begining i assume that not understand how it work. Realy sorry about this, see what i've said, i'm not trying to cause trouble, i give up.

I know, but in those cases i'm thinking that translate the correct page. When i understanded how it work become easy. If you can erase that link to portuguese in "Babel's" page, i've already add a link "Otherlang Babel/pt". Thanks for the help, and the pacience!

Copyright tagging

I'm slowly losing my fear of copyright tagging (sorry, default mindset for us medical people is "extreme phobia of anything that could conceivably end in a lawsuit"!)

I'm fine with the basic principles of date of death of author/editor etc, what I'm not sure about is copyright renewal/ reissue. Also for identification/ verification of scores, I don't have anything to check or compare with. (have to take the word of the sources I glean scores from.)

Oh well - gradually learning as I go along. Not so much time for scanning at the moment, most of the time I set up the computer so I can press a few buttons and upload a file in between patients at work. There are still lots of treasures waiting to be unearthed in the Danish Royal Library and other websites.

Aldona 21:31, 10 September 2008 (EDT)

Could not log on to forum: seems to be solved.

Peter, thanks for your message. I tried to log on and it seems to be working. Cheers, Robert.

de Bériot

There's already a Category:Bériot, Charles-Auguste de created in May 2007, linked to from the English Wikipedia page on the composer, and containing many but not all the pieces now in Category:Beriot, Charles de which you created (that is, same PDF, different container). (It contains 6 files to the latter's 7, lacking the Opéra-sans-paroles.) It may be advisable to do something about this rather confuzzling situation. I have suggested some sort of merge, anyway... Eric 18:49, 20 September 2008 (EDT)

Solved. Moved all files. However haven't checked the contents. --Peter talk 05:08, 21 September 2008 (EDT)

Thanks- and I now finally (as of this morning, figured out why I didn' never mind.) have a IMDBP account and can add things like no. movements, etc. in that area when missing. (I may not be able to scan well enough yet but I can do that *g*) Anyhow. Sorry about the trouble. Eric 07:59, 21 September 2008 (EDT)

Sorry Peter,

Ik begrijp zeer zeker Engels!

Ik probeer uiteraard de guidelines te volgen en me te onderwerpen aan de copyright-rules. Tot mijn grote spijt weet ik niet alle geboortedata van arrangeurs/trancribers en componisten, maar doe mijn uiterste best deze te vinden. Hier gaat soms veel tijd in zitten met soms weinig resultaat. Door de jaren heen (sinds ongeveer 1998) heb ik rond de 20.000 stuks pianomuziek en 8.000 stuks vocale muziek gescand, maar vooral ook verzameld via het internet. Bij de verzamelde werken via internet is het voor mij dikwijls onmogelijk achter de juiste gegevens te komen. Jullie schijnen echter over praktisch alle gegevens te beschikken waardoor het voor jullie mogelijk is de juiste gegevens in te voeren. Als staflid zou ik dit persoonlijk ook als een uitdaging zien! Ik begrijp echter volkomen dat dit wel tijdrovend kan zijn. Bedenk echter ook dat uploaders niet altijd volledige kennis hebben van wat ze uploaden, daar heb ik namelijk voorbeelden genoeg van gezien tot nu. Is dit echter een reden om dikwijls fantastische uitgaven maar niet te sharen met de wereld.

Als uploader ben ik nieuw en er zijn ongelooflijk veel regels waar ik me aan moet conformeren, gun me echter een beetje tijd om de juiste ingangen te vinden.

Als professioneel musicus (zang & piano) heb ik net zoveel bewondering voor een arrangeur/transcriber als de originele componist van een werk. Het is namelijk een grote kunst om de essentie van een werk te vangen in een arrangement/transcriptie. Daarom gaat mijn voorkeur meestal uit naar het onderbrengen van deze werken op naam van de bewerker. Denk hierbij aan de grote hoeveelheid werken van Liszt of Stradal. Ook u/jij hebt bijvoorbeeld een transcriptie door Bartok van Bach ondergebracht bij Bartok zelf. Een professioneel musicus zoekt meestal in 1ste instantie naar de bewerker en persoonlijk vind ik jou/jullie voorgestelde werkwijze onoverzichtelijk. Dit is echter persoonlijk (so don't shoot me!).

Nogmaals mijn excuses voor het feit dat ik wat foutjes gemaakt heb!

Als besluit wil ik jullie complimenteren met een fantastische site waar de muziek- liefhebber/professional zijn hart kan ophalen en genieten van de parels uit het verleden welke dikwijls vergeten zijn maar dikwijls zeer zeker de moeite van het spelen zijn. Fantastisch werk!!!

Met vriendelijke en muzikale groet



I was wondering if you could finish scannign the Bach-Gesellschaft Ausgabe. I know the remaining volume's insignificant, but I would love to see at least one entry in "completed projects." On a related note, shouldn't the uploading of other complete works editions (especially beethoven, Mozart, Schubert, Schumann, Brahms, and Berlioz - maybe Haydn too) should be made projects?

Hi. The BGA is already fully scanned, not by me. You can find it everywhere on the internet. The last volume is a hard one of only manuscripts that need identification, haven't got time for this now. Feel free to help. The other breitkopf complete editions are almost completely uploaded, at least of what can be found on the net. They shouldn't be projects as there circulate to my knowledge no copies that have more completion than the ones we have. P.S. Please sign your comments on talk pages, best regards, --Peter talk 04:34, 30 September 2008 (EDT)
Sorry, I forgot to sign. Thank you!--Snailey 16:59, 30 September 2008 (EDT)
Indeed you are right; a copy can be found here. However, I do not want to upload this file - 500-some mg! I can totally understand any unwillingness! --Snailey 18:00, 30 September 2008 (EDT)
Yes, the file has to be split into individual works. Peter talk 04:07, 1 October 2008 (EDT)
I went ahead and tried it. Currently I am doing the St. Matthew's Passion (23 Pages!!!), and have had no trouble - except a slow transfcer for the 9+ page files. Thank you for your contributions to this project! I am glad I can help! (P.S. I have split all the files. I just need to upload them)--Snailey 14:17, 12 October 2008 (EDT)
That's very nice!--Peter talk 14:38, 12 October 2008 (EDT)
It is done. Except for the b minor mass (Too big) and No. 13 (see BGA page for title)(missing from CA BGA), they are all up. Phew!--Snailey 21:53, 12 October 2008 (EDT)Í
Thank you for uploading the last file! My dream of seeing a completed project is now complete!--Snailey Yell at me 21:49, 3 November 2008 (EST)

William Tell transcription

Yes, indeed I am.

Maksymilian 08:54, 3 October 2008 (EDT)


I understand that you are busy, but I noticed the Brahms complete edition on your to-do list. We have one complete edition of Brahms's works on IMSLP, but this edition is considered the gold standard for Brahms. Don't you think that this would be a valuable thing to finish?--Snailey Yell at me 13:00, 14 November 2008 (EST)

Louis Spohr sonata in D for harp and cello. Op.113.

The scan of the Louis Spohr sonata in D for harp and violin, Op.113, titled by IMSLP "Sonata Concertante" is one also scored for harp and cello. If you can find the score for cello and upload it, I would be sooo grateful. It's a beautiful piece and I'd like to learn it. (I am a cellist.) my regular email is

Best regards, Charlie

Sorry, don't have that. --Peter talk 09:52, 9 December 2008 (EST)


Nice work! Learned some new things from your update. Carolus 18:11, 17 December 2008 (EST)

Actually Grove's is the only source I could find. I was suprised by the relative extensive covering of the music publishers! --Peter talk 18:14, 17 December 2008 (EST)
I second Carolus.Snailey Yell at me Email me 11:09, 18 December 2008 (EST)

Haydn Cello Concerto

You could be right. I got it off a CD with lots of music on it. And it did not have any info on it. Thanks for finding out for me. Somewhere there must be a Haydn C Major that is not (c)opywrite. I shall keep looking. Thanks for your help. Generoso 12:12, 22 December 2008 (EST)

If It was found - discovered - in 1962 (actually it was discovered in 1961 in a private music collection in Czechoslovakia) then the origianl manuscript or earlier edition must be somewhere. I wish I could find that score! (As well as the other two concertos that are still missing or unknown)! Thanks Generoso 13:12, 22 December 2008 (EST)

Jan-Aug 2009

Sapellnikoff, Wassily

Hello Peter. Would the new section for this composer-pianist be better headed "Sapelnikov, Vassily" rather than the German version of his name? Google confirms that Sapelnikov is the norm for English speakers, despite Wikipedia's assertion to the contrary. The latter source appears to be somewhat unreliable, as his middle name is even given as "Leonidovich" instead of "L'vovich" (!) P.davydov 16:40, 8 January 2009 (EST)

Hi, I took this version because it was the transliteration Sapelnikov used himself (Like Rachmaninoff), as I indeed read on Wikipedia. Feel free to change to the correct transliteration! --Peter talk 16:45, 8 January 2009 (EST)

Thanks for the prompt response. Wouldn't it require an administrator like yourself to change the name in a composer category? P.davydov 04:12, 9 January 2009 (EST)

Just to add that "Vassily Sapelnikov" is the US Library of Congress's approved form in their name authority catalog P.davydov 06:01, 9 January 2009 (EST)

Thanks, Peter. I've just noticed you've made the change P.davydov 07:40, 9 January 2009 (EST)


Hi Peter, Do you know when the 32 Piano Pieces were first published? If it was 1965, I seriously doubt they are free in Canada since Canada's pseudo Rule of the Shorter Term would not apply to Skalkottas since he's still under copyright in his country of origin (Greece - 70pma). He's not PD in the EU until 2020, just like Richard Strauss, who also died in 1949. The 32 Piano Pieces would be free in Canada (only) if they were first published before 1959 and the 1965 score is an Urtext-type edition which doesn't differ substantially from the earlier published version. Thanks, Carolus 15:40, 25 January 2009 (EST)

Hi. I highly doubt that these pieces or any but a very select few are actually PD in Canada. Because Skalkottas was relatively unknown until the recent or current president of the Skalkottas society decided to publish editions of his music with Margun, none was published until about the 60s. Daphnis 18:18, 30 January 2009 (EST)


Since he died only in 1986, is there any particular reason you're uploading his stuff here? Carolus 17:49, 30 January 2009 (EST)

Yes, that is, preserving the pre1923 content of the MIT archive. I know it will not be accessible, but I don't have any idea of the plans of Feldmahler about both the US only files and the Canada only files. --Peter talk 17:51, 30 January 2009 (EST)

OK, I'm just a little worried that it will encourage the crazy folks who like to upload anything they can find. (I tend to follow Richard Strauss' legendary remark about the brass section when it comes to these folks; Don't even look at them, or encourage them in any way. :) Do you have access to the FTP server? I've been uploading lots of CDSM stuff there for cleaning. There is also a directory devoted to misc. files not yet available - including PD USA stuff. There's also the seemingly endless stream of complaints about files being blocked. If you don't have the UserID and password for the FTP and wish to store things there, let me know. Carolus 18:04, 30 January 2009 (EST)

OK, I have the login for the FTP server, but as I didn't check this for weeks I did't know that there was this folder and that it might be a better place for these files. Thanks. You have any ideas about what to expect from a legal point of view about US / CA only files ? --Peter talk 18:06, 30 January 2009 (EST)
Actually this system of two logins to the FTP is quite confusing. --Peter talk 18:12, 30 January 2009 (EST)
I agree with Carolus' unspoken opinion that because he died so recently, I would avoid uploading any of his works here. If preservation of these couple works is all that's at stake I wouldn't worry--I actually have produced my own scans of his PD-US works that are much high-quality than those found in the MIT archive. If we ever get the US server going in some fashion, I can upload these along with a few others (there isn't much published of his before 1923). Daphnis 18:21, 30 January 2009 (EST)

The legal issue revolves around the physical location of the server where files are hosted. In order to have files available like Stravinksy's Firebird, which is free in the USA, they have to be hosted in the US. The nastier question is how long will it take Boosey & Hawkes to send us a C & D letter should we make such files downloadable to all visitors. The simple disclaimer in place now might not be enough to stop a lawsuit from someone like B & H. IMSLP's Parent company, Project Petrucci, LLC is in the USA, as is Boosey & Hawkes. That raises the whole issue of whether a territory specific blocking technology (and its effectiveness) would be required to absolve IMSLP of legal responsibility instead of a simple disclaimer. Carolus 18:34, 30 January 2009 (EST)


I left some comments on my talk page. In addition, maybe a user group could be created that cannot change tags that have been edited already, to prevent wars?-- Snailey Yell at me Email me 19:31, 2 February 2009 (EST)

What do you think?-- Snailey Yell at me Email me 22:24, 6 February 2009 (EST)
Actually, after mulling it over, being a copyright reviewer sounds like an interesting position that would be quite worth considering. But the previous system should probably be implemented first, although I wouldn't have the patience for "wars." I'll mention htis idea to Carolus.-- Snailey Yell at me Email me 23:07, 7 February 2009 (EST)

More CR

Hi Peter, Carolus, Perlnerd666; I presume you're all reading this...

I very much doubt there have been edit wars of late, though I will be happy to be corrected. I think some of the new features of the improved tagging system – different copyright regimes for Canada, US, and EU; extra flags such as the Urtext flag; along with better clarification of some of the domain-related legalities – have led to a finer-grained ability to specify the copyright status, which usually helps to remove the ambiguity as to why CR team member X has tagged a work the way s/he has. Some examples:

  • the urtext flag can be used independently on a work published in Europe, to denote a 70pma term is not in effect, e.g. V/V/V*
  • most (if not all) of the CR team should know the difference between marking a score C, V, or !N, and in the case of the US particularly, should know the various year ranges that result in different possible copyrights (28+67 from pub., 95 from pub., 70pma)

Finally, in some ways the term CR is a misnomer, as the etymology of the word is from the French revoir, "to see again", yet most of the work of the team is an initial determination of copyright status when a score is first uploaded to the site. Rather than your idea of another user group with a certain amount of privilege to change some tags but not others, I would be more in favour of allowing any logged-in user to raise a "copyright query" to ask for the tagging of a work to be independently re-assessed. I would not expect this to generate a huge amount of extra work for the CR team. Is there a better place for this to be discussed? :) Regards, Philip Legge @ © talk 18:12, 8 February 2009 (EST)

There have absolutely been no edit wars since reopening, but some blatant mistakes (among which by me) show that a certain tag always has to be regarded with a critical mind. Therefore, the marking of a file to be re-viewed is something I would favor.
I still think that new reviewers should also have a different treatment so that their mistakes will be easily spotted. I think I didn't explain my idea well enough, I don't mean to create user groups with less rights - in contrast, each one should be given full possibilities. I more mean to create one or two groups, based on the level of capabilities, whose tags can be better discerned among say 50 new tags a day. These tags would get the attention they need.
Oh and we hope to be clear on each tag in IMSLP:Copyright Reviewers - this page should be the guide for all new CRs. Points that are still unclear now are the urtext tag in USA, and the use of C or V in RoST.
So maybe I can summarise and try to concretise for Feldmahler (please add your opinion):
-creation of a new flag in the tag, that would be activated on request of a non-CR user by clicking of a link. this flag serves to review an existing tag where there is suspicion of an error , and maybe also (see discussions way back) to prioritize files that have not been reviewed yet. In regard of the latter, a counter in this flag could be interesting too.
-creation of separate CR levels, so that the tags of each group can be listed or visualised differently (e.g. list all tags of group 1). Alternatively, a mode "list all tags of user x" would do too.
Of course this may sound overstructured at this time, but in a future when there would be tens of CR this would be very efficient.
I'll copy this to the admin board on the forum to discuss it further so we can give a nice bundle of work for Feldmhler:) --Peter talk 19:19, 8 February 2009 (EST)
Makes a lot of sense. I particularly like the idea of a watchlist-type page for admins to see, sortable by date, user, etc.-- Snailey Yell at me Email me 21:34, 8 February 2009 (EST)

Some good points made above. I'm a little hesitant to make it too easy for any user to flag a tagged title. There is simply far too much misinformation about copyright out there - some of which is deliberate. Still, it's good to have some sort of mechanism whereby the present tags can be flagged for a review. Most of the job presently consists of looking over the new additions and making some sort of determination about the status. As for new Copyright taggers, some of the easiest items to 'cut your teeth' on are cases like all of the orchestra parts now starting to appear. These are (fairly obviously) CDSM/OMCDRL titles which are presently being sold worldwide. Most of the core orchestral repertoire is represented, and in cases where Breitkopf issued a complete works series (Bach, Beethoven, Berlioz, Brahms, Mendelssohn, Schubert, Schumann), the orchestral and large choral works were typically included in the Orchester-Bibliothek (though they changed and re-assigned numbers, it would appear). If you see an obvious case like one of these, we know right off the bat that it will be at least C/V/C and more often than not V/V/V. BTW, this is not for public announcement yet, but Feldmahler is planning to un-block the items which have only a single red tag (like the late works of Ravel) sometime in the next 2-3 months. This should at least slow down the constant stream of questions about why certain files are blocked. Carolus 23:03, 8 February 2009 (EST)

Also makes sense. That's good news, though I won't be doing much different, as a US user. I don't think that all users should be allowed to tag; sub-groups or Peter's watchlist-type page sound like the best thing. -- Snailey Yell at me Email me 12:36, 9 February 2009 (EST)
Ought we move this to IMSLP talk:Copyright Reviewers?-- Snailey Yell at me Email me 12:18, 11 February 2009 (EST)
Could I receive a copy of the test?-- Snailey Yell at me Email me 10:36, 22 February 2009 (EST)
Want to do a bit of cramming, eh? :) Philip Legge @ © talk 18:20, 22 February 2009 (EST)
To be honest I don't know where the test is right now :) Maybe on the ftp server. --Peter talk 04:31, 23 February 2009 (EST)
Discovered it amongst the thousand orphan files :) - regards, Philip Legge @ © talk 03:59, 24 February 2009 (EST)

Cool. And, yes, that's it exactly :-)
Does the "not officially submitted" notice mean something that I should know?-- Snailey Yell at me Email me 19:36, 2 March 2009 (EST)

? --Peter talk 19:47, 2 March 2009 (EST)
I suspect that it has something to do with me not being a CR; it gives me that when I click on the files (accidentally) that haven't been reviewed, but directly, instead of from the page.-- Snailey Yell at me Email me 19:48, 2 March 2009 (EST)
Ah I can't see those messages any more. Don't know who installed it, probably it will give this when tag is UUU. Btw, that copyright test is too easy :D --Peter talk 19:55, 2 March 2009 (EST)
Works for me ;-)-- Snailey Yell at me Email me 19:58, 2 March 2009 (EST)

File template

Hi Peter, could you please clarify your claim "Filetemplate is messed up in IE6"? I just tested several work pages in IE6, and apart from some odd spacings they looked pretty normal. In what sense do they appear "messed up" on your computer? Does it apply to all pages? If not, could you give examples of problematic pages and describe the problem? Thanks --Leonard Vertighel 13:53, 7 February 2009 (EST)

Also, is it still true that 'filetemplate: typeset wrongly described as "Scanned by..."' [6]? If yes, could you provide a sample page where this occurs? --Leonard Vertighel 14:01, 7 February 2009 (EST)

Scanning resolution in monocrome

Hi Peter, I made a test pdf with 3 pages scanned in different "strategies" Papillons, Op.2 (Schumann, Robert). First page in 600 dpi color converted to monocrome with PhotoLine Software. The second page being scanned in monocrome 600 dpi directly (called Lineart in the scanner driver). The third page was scanned using the scanner drivers option to scan in 2400 dpi and scale the result down to 600 dpi, returning only the 600 dpi monocrome picture. All three files seem to look nearly the same to me (perhaps color scan and monocrome conversion via software could be optimized). But also when I take a look at e.g. your Schubert "Wanderer Fantasie" scans, I don't see any differences to the quality of my results (just a few remaining black borders). All in all I would always prefer the 600 dpi monocrome before any 300 dpi grey - the Original was printed using just black color and any printer that has to print the pdf will use just black color. --Matthias talk 19:01, 15 February 2009 (EST)

Thank you very much. As expected, it's really hard to distinguish the scans. I have a slight preference for the first page, but only when zoomed in closely... There is a difference in smoothness especially of the horizontal staff lines but it's hard to tell which is best. I suppose this is an optical interference issue (eg difference in frequency of the scanning lines and the staff lines) and a matter of coincidence (where the page is placed in relation to the scanner head). A different leveling for conversion to monochrome, between the scanning software and the manual leveling in the photo software, could explain this too. In any way, as discussed on the forums too, the scanning resolution does not make much difference any more once above 600 dpi. --Peter talk 05:26, 16 February 2009 (EST)
BTW I have removed the file from the Papillons page but is still accessible here.

Page protection

After the latest vandalism spree I decided to preemptively change the protection level of all sysops' user and talk pages (including yours). The pages can still be edited by every user as before, but only sysops are now able to rename the page using the "move" button. --Leonard Vertighel 07:30, 22 February 2009 (EST)

Die Schöne Müllerin, D.795 (Op.25)

Sibley Library has asked that we not post the first edition for the time being, since they obtained it from New York Public, who apparently is in serious need of some education about the nature of copyright wrt scans of public domain scores. At any rate, because Jim Farrington (Sibley) is a good friend of IMSLP, I'll take these down. BTW, I tried to post an announcement of this at the forum a few days back, but with the attack have been unable to even get to the forum. I'll put a notice on the workpage. Thanks, Carolus 13:52, 22 February 2009 (EST)

OK.--Peter talk 13:58, 22 February 2009 (EST)

Glazunow and all my last uploads

I have just replaced all my lasts files uploaded. I don't know what's the matter with thoose. For me all worked and works very well. I can read all my old files perfectly by many readers (evince kpdf xpdf adobe8) By the way I replaced all.(I redistill all files by printing them again using adobe) If the problem persist advise me. Thank you



Hi Professor Carlos! Thanks, but actually I didn't have these problems, it was daphnis who could'nt read them. My browser keeps on crashing lik before but thats a bug in the plugin.
cheeers peter


Hi Peter. I just noticed that you've added a new composer page for Drozdov, and recognised his name as one of the editors of the Tchaikovsky complete edition. His first name is usually transliterated in English as "Anatoly" (or sometimes "Anatolii"). Glad to see him making an appearance as a composer! — P.davydov 10:02, 28 February 2009 (EST)

Yes I doubted about the correct transliteration (if existant) - the letter for letter transliteration gave -ij but I already noticed on e.g. Wikipedia that most Anatolij's and Anatolij's became Anatoly... Should I change the category? --Peter talk 10:52, 28 February 2009 (EST)

Hi again Peter. It's the different transliteration systems that are confusing. The one that gives "Anatolij" also produces "Čajkovskij" for Tchaikovsky, for example, and it tends to be used in central European languages. "Anatoly" would be more in line with IMSLP's current usage, if that helps. — P.davydov 11:56, 28 February 2009 (EST)

OK, done --Peter talk 17:23, 28 February 2009 (EST)

New publishers

I copied this from Carolus's page; you might find it helpful.-- Snailey Yell at me Email me 14:51, 1 March 2009 (EST)

I made a page for J.G. Cotta. Feel free to add info, etc. at will. -- Snailey Yell at me Email me 18:20, 27 February 2009 (EST)
And the same for Arthur P. Schmidt.-- Snailey Yell at me Email me 14:14, 28 February 2009 (EST)
And F. Lucca. -- Snailey Yell at me Email me 14:31, 28 February 2009 (EST)
And Aibl.-- Snailey Yell at me Email me 14:49, 28 February 2009 (EST)
Oh, and I created a page for Ballard. Very interesting.-- Snailey Yell at me Email me 14:51, 1 March 2009 (EST)

Thanks. I just love this. I'll add them to Music Publishers --Peter talk 14:52, 1 March 2009 (EST)

You're welcome, unless that was e-sarcasm ;-)-- Snailey Yell at me Email me 14:53, 1 March 2009 (EST)
Absolutely not, Aibl is now even the first listed in the table --Peter talk 14:58, 1 March 2009 (EST)
Sorry. To make it up to you, I made a page for Carulli, so you don't have to use that table-within-a-table.-- Snailey Yell at me Email me 15:03, 1 March 2009 (EST)
Heheh :) --Peter talk 15:12, 1 March 2009 (EST)


Could I take the test soon (and how is it taken?)-- Snailey Yell at me Email me 11:11, 5 March 2009 (EST)

I sent you an email.-- Snailey Yell at me Email me 20:27, 5 March 2009 (EST)


Breitkopf had some sort of distribution/co-publication deal with Bessel in the early part of the 20th century and actually re-engraved a number of Bessel titles which were issued under a joint imprint. The Chernov piano transcription you just posted is one of these. It was re-issued by Breitkopf in 1989, but this engraving appears to date from around 1920, maybe a little before. It's PD, so I'll tag accordingly. Carolus 18:08, 11 March 2009 (EDT)

Thanks. Your knowledge is unsurpassable! --Peter talk 18:24, 11 March 2009 (EDT)

Your typeset

It's very nice; by posting here, it actually counts as publication, so you should list yourself as the publisher.-- Snailey Yell at me Email me 17:57, 15 March 2009 (EDT)

Ah right. --Peter talk 17:59, 15 March 2009 (EDT)

BGA missing pages

Peter, do you know whether IMSLP:Community Projects/Bach-Gesellschaft Ausgabe Missing Pages is still correct? I have circulating privileges at a library that has a paper copy of a reprint of the BGA and could conceivably scan the missing pages if they are still needed.

Johann Caspar Ferdinand Fischer 21:55, 26 March 2009 (EDT)

I have no idea if these pages are corrected. A while ago however I uploaded a series of corrections to the original BGA scan. This was BWV 11, 15, 16, 22, 29, 36, 38, 42, 48, 57, 69, 100, 110, 127, 149, 152, 169, 173, 179, 198--Peter talk 17:46, 27 March 2009 (EDT)

Featured Scores

I will be away on Monday and Tuesday; could you please do the featured scores for those two days? Thanks. The Upcoming section is commented out.-- Snailey Yell at me Email me 10:57, 3 April 2009 (EDT)

Hello, I have "Rigoletto" clavier, it's issued 1955 in Soviet Russia, and has Russian text too, but Russian author isn't mentioned anywhere in the book. Could I scan it? Brit

Question: Deletion of LilyPond source file

Hello, Peter. I have a question for you. I typeset and uploaded Et Incarnatus Est, by Juan Muñoz. The link to the source code is now link to a deleted page, which you removed. My question is, what's the proper way to store the source code for reference (mine and others') along with the PDF. Thank you

Hi there. I suggest you put this question on the forum, as I'm not really into this discussion any more, and it's about time for a good renewed discussion whether sourcecode should be allowed. there should be a lot of reaction! Peter talk 16:59, 30 April 2009 (EDT)


Hi Peter,

I saw your request for help with the MIT project on the Sibley Mirroring page when I was looking around for something to do. If you would like me to help with this, please let me know. Physicist 21:27, 16 May 2009 (EDT)

Oh, another question: since I intend to do some uploading, how do I qualify as a copyright reviewer? Do I still take the three-page test, or has the procedure changed? Thanks. Physicist 21:29, 16 May 2009 (EDT)

I guess you don't have the password yet. As you were a previous project member, this is no problem, but i'll need your e-mail for this. You can mail me on the left side panel. For CR, better turn to Carolus as I'm not doing a lot around here right now. best regards, Peter talk 08:01, 17 May 2009 (EDT)
I sent you an email a few days ago. If a filter blocked it, you can always email me from my user page. Physicist 17:15, 21 May 2009 (EDT)



Carolus pointed me in your direction when I asked about the captcha and how long it sticks to accounts. I'm interested in helping out, but less so if I have to deal with the captcha for very long. Is it set to go away after a certain amount of time or number of edits? --Spangineer 07:13, 23 May 2009 (EDT)

Hi, I didn't install the captcha so I don't know the exact numbers. Even if I would know I couldn't disclose them, not to jeopardize this antivandalism measurement. I can say it's a combination of both factors, so if you contribute regularly you should not be bothered too long. --Peter talk 08:20, 23 May 2009 (EDT)

Choral de Bach

Bonsoir Peter:

Vous avez indiqué que vous parliez le français, c'est pourquoi je m'adresse à vous dans cette langue qui m'est familière. Vous avez mis en ligne différentes transcriptions (pour piano) de Chorals, composés par JS Bach. Je recherche une transcription du Choral BWV 601. En auriez-vous une à votre disposition ?

Je vous remercie vivement! Babaz 15:03, 30 June 2009 (EDT)

Non, je suis desolé, j'ai mis on ligne tous que j'avais dans mon disposition. bonne chance! --Peter talk 15:22, 30 June 2009 (EDT)


I added a page for Artaria - quite interesting. I figured you might want to update your great table.-- Snailey Talk to Me Email me 04:52, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

Thanks, feel free to add it! --Peter talk 20:37, 27 July 2009 (UTC)
OK then...done.-- Snailey Talk to Me Email me 20:44, 27 July 2009 (UTC)

Fwd: kcleung

Hi Leonard, kcleung has passed the CR test 9.5/10. You can assign him CR status now. Carolus 22:29, 27 July 2009 (UTC)

Copyright Review

Hi Peter, kcleung has passed the CR test 9.5/10. (he missed the 2nd half of No.2) You can assign him CR status now. Carolus 01:01, 28 July 2009 (UTC)

Ed already did. --Peter talk 08:16, 28 July 2009 (UTC)

New Template

I created Template:PopSection to try to stop people from creating redundant sectional work pages. I implemented it for Le Cygne (Saint-Saëns, Camille), as an example. Feel free to mess with it!-- Snailey Talk to Me Email me 20:03, 28 July 2009 (UTC)

nice! --Peter talk 20:09, 28 July 2009 (UTC)
Well, it was sort of Daphnis's ideaish.-- Snailey Talk to Me Email me 20:10, 28 July 2009 (UTC)

Walker - Lionel Tertis

He was English, as I recall. Therefore NAFTA does not come into play. I think you replaced the viola part for the Zellner concerto with your upload of the Walker Sonata. I moved the part over to Walker. This would be protected in both Canada and the EU. Carolus 05:48, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for the clarification. I think this message was meant for User talk:Notnd, I didn't upload it. --Peter talk 07:09, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

P.Davydov and Leonard

Should be made an admin and a bureaucrat, respectively. Sorry if Feld beats you to it.-- Snailey Talk to Me Email me 19:18, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

And he did.-- Snailey Talk to Me Email me 14:36, 4 August 2009 (UTC)
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