User talk:Pml/Archive 4


Mozart Wind Serenades K375 & K388

Hallo Philip, I have my own 600dpi scans of score and parts from the 1979 NMA edition for the 2 Serenades for 8 winds (K375, K388), I assume, these should be accessible via the EU server and I would like to upload them. The NMA editions of the 6 wind sextets, on the other hand are from 1984, and would still have to wait until 2014? There I have only the scores scanned (I started to contribute parts from the Breitkopf editions)--Kalliwoda 23:52, 2 January 2011 (UTC)

Happy new year Kalliwoda, and many apologies for a tardy reply. I believe both sets of scores and parts ought to have expired if they are truly urtexts, since the term in Germany is specifically 25 years, slightly less than the mandated maximum across the European Union of 30 years; the term in the country of origin thus takes precedence. One minor thing to check would be that the parts were issued at the same time as the scores, and not several years afterwards – although this is less likely with Mozart, it is not uncommon for other urtext editions to have the production of orchestral parts delayed for some time after the appearance of full scores. If (and I repeat, if) this applied to the parts for the wind sextets, say, were they printed just a couple of years after the NMA score, then they would still be under copyright protection while the score is not. Hope this helps, Philip Legge @ © talk 10:11, 5 January 2011 (UTC)

Mendelssohn List


Apologies for the erroneous link. I was working from the Works list maintenance page, and it must have been out of date. Since most works lists contain hyperlinks in the titles themselves, I assumed it wasn't there and didn't think to look elsewhere. There was one work I did not find in your (seemingly exhaustive) MWV list: 2 Songs, Op.112 (Mendelssohn, Felix). I find it hard to believe it is not listed in the new thematic catalog, but you would likely be the better person to ascertain that. Thanks, Casey

Hi Casey,
No worries about the worklist.
Opus 112 is an odd case. As you probably know, all of the opus numbers after 72 were posthumously assigned. Sometimes slightly miscellaneous assortments of separate works were bundled together: for example, some of the last set of Lieder ohne Worte are Kinderstücke so might have been intended for a separate division of works.
The two Op. 112 songs are both arrangements of arias intended for Paulus Op. 36, that were excluded from the final version of the oratorio. “Doch der Herr, er leitet die Irrenden recht” doesn’t specify this, but the text more or less indicates its origin; whereas the second aria “Der du die Menschen lässest sterben” has a subtitle explicitly saying “sopran-arie ursprünglich von Oratorium Paulus componirt”.
I therefore suspect that these two excerpts are included passim under the catalogue entry for Paulus, A 14, as excluded items; they are not really independent pieces despite having been given a posthumous opus number. Cheers, Philip Legge @ © talk 23:46, 14 January 2011 (UTC)

Faurés Requiem

Hi Philip,

I am a tenor in a church choir in Ireland and we are currently trying to learn Faures Requiem. Where possible I like to use Sibelius to isolate the tenor line and make it a bit easier to learn my part. I am not a trained musician and as you can imagine, it takes quite a lot of time to create the parts in Sibelius. I noticed from the site that you had uploaded a Pdf form the Requiem created from Sibelius (unless I've misunderstood) and was wondering if you would be so kind as to share your work.

Best Regards


Hi Martin,
my score isn’t exactly optimised for playback. There are numerous sites which have the score better organised for MIDI playback; CPDL has MIDI and Finale files (both importable into Sibelius) of the default Hamelle arrangement rather than my edition. Cheers, Philip @ © talk 06:28, 11 February 2011 (UTC)

Hi Philip,

I'm a french choir master (beetween Tours and Orléans), and I would like to conduct the Fauré's requiem. I have studied your vocal and full scores of this masterwork ! Great job ! It's really very interresting... I would like to use your edition for my concerts.

Is it possible to use the set of parts ? Where could I find them ?

Thanks for your help, and my apologize for all my mistakes of language !

See you,

Best regards,

Nicolas Pommier

Hi Nicolas,
Parts are in the (e-)mail. Many apologies for the delay in sending them! Cheers, Philip @ © talk 06:28, 11 February 2011 (UTC)

Adieu! (Weyrauch, August Heinrich von)

Good work! Interesting that it turned out not to be one of Schubert's works after all. Cheers! Lndlewis10 00:18, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

We’ve known that for some time… the problem was thinking of what to do with it. There are after all, about four or five different arrangements of it on IMSLP, including ones by Heller and Liszt. Philip Legge @ © talk 00:21, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

Oh... All right then :oops: Lndlewis10 00:30, 31 January 2011 (UTC)


Yes, I see that was my goof on December 26th. Ow!!!! Very embarrassing - not completely unknown though fortunately not common with me either. - I hope. Eric 01:35, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

I’ll remove it at some later point, now that you’ve admitted to being the culprit ;-) Generally the wishlists shouldn’t be used for sending messages, though I was a little less than subtle in a few places! Philip Legge @ © talk 01:38, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
& thanks for looking at Dohnányi… PML

Re sending messages - likewise, but yes, generally ended up taking them to the offender's talk page when they were severe and repeated and localized enough (... recently.) Eric 02:12, 1 February 2011 (UTC)


Well, he wrote his first published piece in 1919 (scherzo for orchestra in F minor, op.1). This much is the case, I gather?... but this becomes alchemized on some sites and even, I think, possibly in some books (like guides to classical music, etc.) to his first published piece having been published in 1919, which I do not gather was the case. As far as I can presently determine, it was published with another of his scherzi for orchestra (op.7?) and possibly with opus 3 (the Sokolov-dedicated theme and variations) as well, not sure, as dva scherzi (or somesuch, in Russian, not Italian) around 1928... the date of the first publication of Shostakovich (that I know of (?)). But that is as far as I know at the moment; a really good scholarly work would hopefully settle this... Eric 04:22, 2 February 2011 (UTC)

Yes, it’s the publication date that matters. Anyway, in respect of linking composers: the Category link is only to be suppressed if the composer’s death date is post-1960, and IMSLP does not hold any of their works. (One interesting exception is composers who have worklists: the links in the wishlist headings of York Bowen and Havergal Brian don’t go to composer category pages, but to their worklists. Oddly, we don’t have a worklist for Shosty.) Cheers Philip Legge @ © talk 04:41, 2 February 2011 (UTC)

User talk:Schissel#Violin Sonata in F major, Op.Posth. (Mendelssohn, Felix)

looking for the appropriate catalog number, not having luck at the moment. will resume search later. thought I'd found it awhile ago... thanks. some sketches for an F major sonata from the same year are also mentioned in Todd's Mendelssohn and his World, but Google Books has that page in unreadable preview. I really have to stop back at the university library, used to go there all the time, it's been too long... Eric 16:47, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

From the sound of it, Menuhin’s munged together Q 26 and the Q 27 (fragment). The MWV catalogue is roughly chronological within each subdivision of work types, so in terms of chamber music with piano (series Q) 26 and 27 would seem consistent, dating-wise. Cheers Philip @ © talk 00:07, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

Lasso werke template question

Hi, Since we now have the ability to make dates appear by default in the templates (which are over-ridden when the actual date of the volume in question is known), I was wondering if it might be a good idea to change the Lasso template accordingly. Getting rid of the dates in the top line of the listing also has the advantage of making room for a volume title, etc. Carolus 03:16, 4 April 2011 (UTC)

Good idea – I’d seen how this was implemented in the MozartNMA template, and I should have thought to apply it elsewhere.
As for the Lasso dates, the Complete Motets by Bergquist et al. seem pretty certain that the Haberl/Sandberger set came to grief in 1927, not 1926; this also provided the source for the final dates for the neue Reihe by Bärenreiter, which finished in 1995. I’m trying to get hands on a copy of Leuchtmann & Schmid’s Orlando di Lasso. Seine Werke to check all of these info are definitive. Cheers Philip @ © talk 03:24, 4 April 2011 (UTC)

My old copy of the Heyer book states 1926, but that's probably not definitive as it's a 1965 edition. Carolus 03:48, 4 April 2011 (UTC)


thanks for the message- have been busy most of this weekend but still apologies for not responding, should have some more time tomorrow/Tuesday/etc. Briefly you’re right of course... (though I reserve the right to disagree with LC authorities when they risk confusion. There are a number of works arguably by one Raff brother still attributed to another more famous one and some effort by LC and LC-authorities to help clear this up now that this has been brought to this attention - especially since most of the scans of these works are on their website - would probably help... ah well, personal dead-horse-a-flogging. As to the article I read, it was probably this one and seq.! Am sort of responsible for a rather less impressive bit of work myself, over on MusicWeb I think- sufficiently less so I am not boasting of it certainly... All best! Eric 03:33, 4 April 2011 (UTC)

Alessandro Striggio, Motet Ecce Beatam Lucem

Dear Mr Legge,

I am working for Le Concert Spirituel conducted by Hervé Niquet in France. Le Concert Spirituel will perform this summer the "Missa sopra Ecco si beato giorno" of Alessandro Striggio with the motet "Ecce beatam Lucem". We would like to use your score of the motet, but I have a question for you from the musicians. They have chosen to transpose all the program one tone below, we wandered if it would be possible for you to transpose the score of the motet, we are doing the same for the Mass.

Thanks a lot for your help, With my best regards, Isabelle Pichon-Varin

Isabelle, please provide me with an e-mail address to respond to – you can send me a message through this e-mail link provided you have set up your IMSLP account preferences using a valid e-mail address.
Regards, Philip @ © talk 15:12, 8 April 2011 (UTC)

Reger, Max

Dear Philip, I've just seen that the composer's portrait disappeared after your changes. As I don't know if it is intendet (e.g. copyrighted material) I didn't change anything so far. Regards --Ralph Theo Misch 08:04, 30 April 2011 (UTC)

Fixed – that’s what happens when you omit the word “Caption” :-) Cheers Philip @ © talk 08:06, 30 April 2011 (UTC)


ah, gotcha!

ah! congrats :)

and cheers!! Eric 02:26, 6 May 2011 (UTC)

Thanks! Philip @ © talk 03:15, 6 May 2011 (UTC)


no, there wasn't. I am going to go so far, though, as to venture the opinion that having two categories for one composer was a worse solecism- and have to admit I am just too tired now to move them all back into the other category. Eric 05:06, 21 May 2011 (UTC)


Thanks, that rewrite was a great improvement and much appreciated :) Eric 02:08, 24 May 2011 (UTC)

Think NPOV, my dear Eric, NPOV... Currently, I’m a bit stuck on Scriabin; his dates are totally wrong, whether one uses Old Style or New Style. Philip @ © talk 02:20, 24 May 2011 (UTC)
Worked it out – someone typed “born” in place of “died”, which upsets the apple cart! PML

New Australian Composers

Hi Phil - Definitely a newbie, but I'll be adding some material over the next few days. Thanks --Gproud 05:29, 4 June 2011 (UTC)

No probs – just make sure you have permission to post material of any Aussies who were alive on 1 January 1955 or not yet born ;-) Before that date, it’s open slather. Philip @ © talk 05:50, 4 June 2011 (UTC)


Well, I have finally delivered on my promise made a while back. Have fun. Yes, I have an OK recording of it.-- Snailey (_@/) Talk to Me Email me 01:35, 6 June 2011 (UTC)

It’s about time! ;-) Cheers, Philip @ © talk 01:42, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
Therefore, if it's about time (well, more or less, sort of), some tell me, it has to do with music :) Eric 03:08, 25 June 2011 (UTC)

Biblioteca Digital Hispanica

Hi Philip, many thanks for your great help! As I'm not as familiar with that subject as I should, I've planned to ask you before I started to upload any file. Already begun to clean, but in this case it's rather complicated. So it'll take one or two sessions for completion. --Ralph Theo Misch 00:09, 24 June 2011 (UTC)

That's okay, the scores are marvellous additions irrespective of the silly copyright notice. I've had the good luck to sing the rather cabbalistic tertii et octavi toni setting, which gradually increases from three to eight voices: a brilliant piece of invention. And Tallis Scholars amongst others have recorded the whole set. Thanks again Phi1ip 00:46, 24 June 2011 (UTC)
Done. - Hopefully without any losses. Cheers --Ralph Theo Misch 00:03, 25 June 2011 (UTC)
Excellent! Straight to the Featured Scores queue, I think! Phi1ip 00:15, 25 June 2011 (UTC)

Wishlist, take 2 or - something!

I'll get it eventually. sooner than later. Was using {{SUBST:EN}} in place of an amped ndash (no drugged up ndashes for me I guess) for awhile - not that it matters- and then simply copied and pasted the results of the latter instead - but point indeed taken sincerely and will use the standard form and a mostly compressed form (can omit the date of publication information but had really rather not- I feel tetchy when others do so. which raises another issue. have been creating several beginnings, several of them medium-length, of opus number lists for composers, some of them for composers who we don't yet have much actually by in terms of works uploaded. My rationalization for this, if it matters !, is that I try to include some plate information in these worklists, as accurate as possible using as many sources, HMB and pre-HMB (like AMZ, others) as possible, to be able to make the publisher-page plate tables a little more accurate and filled in relatively speaking using that information, ideally, It is more or less a rationalization, mostly, however (sometimes realized, mostly not.)

Anyway, thanks! hope you will be in London next month though unfortunately I will not be able to make it after all... Eric 03:07, 25 June 2011 (UTC)

Vuvuzela Concerto

I think it must have taken true eccentricity to be the first to write a bona fide Vuvuzela Concerto. If I wrote one, too, I would be a copycat rather than a pioneer. So instead I will try using John's piece as a gimmick to put on a concert on which to also put on one of my own pieces and some of the editions I've done for IMSLP. More details here: if the topic interests you any. Alonso del Arte 22:16, 8 July 2011 (UTC)

Kyrie-Versetten (Erbach, Christian)

Your expertise is required here. I'm not sure whether this should be tagged as both, but since it's a solo organ piece, I'm not sure kyrie is appropriate, i.e. it might mean a "kyrie styled versett", in which case versett is the only taggable word. Suggestions/opinions? Thanks, Steltz 08:47, 16 July 2011 (UTC)

Tricky. There are a number of organ compositions which are clearly intended for the Catholic liturgy even though they do not set the words themselves to music; there are many organ magnificats, organ masses, and this is clearly an organ Kyrie (it directly quotes the Gregorian Kyrie known as Jesu Redemptor or Kyrie XIV in the Solesmes Kyriale – IMSLP #52073, page 54 as numbered), so I tagged it as kyrie ; org – unless you think the “versetten” part of the title is worthy of a tag also. Regards, Philip @ © talk 01:42, 17 July 2011 (UTC)

User page formatting help/Proofing

Philip, could you offer some advice on how to arrange the User Finale template so it behaves properly? Also, would you be interested in doing some proof-reading for me shortly? I'm just about finished with this Ibert score for a trio for three winds and would greatly value your eagle eyes. Cheers, Daphnis 22:42, 20 July 2011 (UTC)

I can have a look at the Ibert pieces if you don’t mind a little bit of a wait.
As for the Finale template, yes, that’s weird, but it seems to be invariant of which notation template is there on the page, because the notation templates all align to the left-hand margin, and the Babel/Instrument/Sysop boxes align to the right. I’ve added a little <div> class just to group your Sysop/CR boxes together as the default format has all the userboxes adjacent in five piles, and my change reduces that to four. The other odd thing about your green bounding box is that the width of 96% only allows 4% for the table of contents, and having that colliding with your userboxes is quite odd. So I’ve substituted 75%, though this will involve some slightly weird layout if you have a very narrow width web browser (e.g. on a phone’s web browser like Android/iPhone).
Hope this helps, cheers, Philip @ © talk 09:17, 22 July 2011 (UTC)
Thanks, Philip. I'll email you. Daphnis 13:49, 22 July 2011 (UTC)

Empty wishlist entries

Thanks Philip, I didn't know about that rule, and will bear it in mind in future. Nice to know that Mr Kuznetsov's admirers are content with their lot for the moment :-) — P.davydov 08:08, 26 July 2011 (UTC)

  • I think I set up that particular box (and then found out the score I'd requested was already at Sibley digitized, just not mirrored :) ). But just wait, I'll think of something. *evil laugh* Eric 03:52, 24 August 2011 (UTC)

Mozart Great Mass

Sorry—misled by my Dover score's list in the front...and the set of parts I uploaded with "treble trombone"...-- Snailey (_@/) Talk to Me Email me 03:23, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

Yep. It’s a mistake in the Alte Mozart Ausgabe – heavens alone knows what Philipp Spitta was thinking copying the same mistake that was in the André publication of 1825. It’s never been standard for the sopranos to be doubled by a colla parte trombone – the Viennese tradition was strictly an alto-tenor-bass æquali of three trombones. Philip @ © talk 03:28, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

Good to know—of course you would know this piece rather intimately :) Thanks-- Snailey (_@/) Talk to Me Email me 03:30, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

Also remember the parts are from an arrangement, not representative of the original work, by someone who didn’t have the best of interpretations or viewpoints on the work either – the cuts to some of the movements are gratuitous, and some of the musical decisions in that completion are bizarre. Philip @ © talk 03:41, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

Anyway, now that I’ve looked at the recent changes to the other Mozart masses. Would you like to put the solo and choir voices back into the instrumentation, or shall I? Philip @ © talk 04:43, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

Go ahead. Busy sorting out the Orgelbüchlein manuscript...I'll finish tomorrow...-- Snailey (_@/) Talk to Me Email me 05:12, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

And you can see now...-- Snailey (_@/) Talk to Me Email me 15:39, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

less architecturally speaking re Gothic

ah, sorry- was just being oddly picky about the tempo capitalizations in the Cranz score (don't know why, since it only looks - and only sort of - like a manuscript. And even then... :) ) Eric 03:55, 24 August 2011 (UTC)

No problems. Many thanks for the speedy upload. Do these have the problems the other version apparently did? (Garbled pages 38/72/181) Philip @ © talk 04:13, 24 August 2011 (UTC)
Eric, the extra page for you to upload should now be accessible here. It’s a single page. Philip @ © talk 04:32, 24 August 2011 (UTC)

Uploading- in creating the description for the link page and making it a typeset (haven't done that using the page yet, will see if it lets me sign using your permission etc.) - anyhow- I assume this typeset list has been drawn up in part because the list in the Cranz score is sort of notoriously inaccurate? ... (notes that classical choice TV station is playing suite by Leo Weiner. so distractable :) ) Eric 13:29, 24 August 2011 (UTC)

The pages at the outset of Part One and Part Two are comprehensive, but neither indicates the full orchestration for the ensuing music; in such cases it’s normal to include a page summarising the instrumentation but the scans failed to include it. Philip @ © talk 22:55, 24 August 2011 (UTC)

Not sure what you mean- they both contain full lists of the orchestration of part 1 and part 2 respectively? MacDonald in the Symphonies of Havergal Brian I think had a corrected list that disagreed with Cranz's list(s) based on a study of the score but I don't know the issue well and you have prepared the work closely (and a vocal score of part 2 as well) and know whereof you speak rather better than I who has at best skimmed the full score some while back... anyhow, question answered I think...! Eric 00:55, 25 August 2011 (UTC)

I refer to the convention that at the outset of a piece of music, the first system includes the entire instrumentation regardless of whether all instruments play or not. The first page of the piece has almost all of the instrumentation for Part One, except for the E cornet and a one-line stave for “Percussion” that omits its full extent. The first page of Part Two lacks details of the extra brass forces that first appear in the fifth movement; the 8th members of the flute and oboe families which only turn up in the sixth movement; no mention is given of the even more OTT percussion, etc. Philip @ © talk 01:36, 25 August 2011 (UTC)

Uploaded and included on page. Oddly for a typeset, neither nor any other stage in the process asked me for a statement that I had your permission. Hrm. Eric 01:03, 25 August 2011 (UTC)

It’s an oversight, but I suggest mentioning it to Jdeperi if there’s a concern. Philip @ © talk 01:36, 25 August 2011 (UTC)

Brian’s The Tigers vocal score

Hi Philip. The Jan. to June, 1961 Catalog of Copyright Entries has now made it to and it lacks a renewal for the vocal score to The Tigers. As there was also no NIE filed during 1996 to 1998 the score is PD-US as you believed. I sent a note to Hathi Trust to this effect but I know there is no way they will unblock the score. Thanks! --Cypressdome 00:59, 30 August 2011 (UTC)

Makes me wish I still had borrowing privileges here. I could travel over to the uni library but it would take awhile to photocopy...! Eric 01:37, 30 August 2011 (UTC)
The initial registration of the vocal score (Hathi Trust/Mich Uni) was unproblematic:
 Tigers (The) ; opera, Havergal Brian.
   Voc. sc. © Apr. 29, 1932; E for.
   24183; Cranz & co., ltd.       12529
28 years later, however, the full score of the opera was missing, which effectively stymied any attempts to perform the opera; the three volumes were rediscovered in the disused basement of a publisher in 1977, at which point it became practical once again to stage the work. So again, Cranz probably would have liked to extend the copyright if they had been capable of foretelling the future, but instead the US copyright law is a cruel and unforgiving beast. Hathi won’t unblock the score because of the copyright in other domains; however, the University of Michigan itself might be a little easier to go trawling at? If memory serves, at least one US contributor has perhaps some relatively easy access to a score. Thanks for the info. Regards, Philip @ © talk 03:19, 30 August 2011 (UTC)
Just wanted to let you know that I heard back from Mr. York the Project Librarian with Hathi Trust and at my request they reviewed the copyright status of The Tigers. They are unwilling to unblock it as he states "it is possible for a rights holder to subsequently regain the rights to a volume even if a notice of intent is not filed" and they consider the work to be "in an intermediate state that is difficult to define, and not clearly public domain." Oh well, better luck next time I suppose. --Cypressdome 01:11, 20 September 2011 (UTC)
Yes. And also, PD–US only PD–worldwide! Sorry can’t stay to chat but thanks for posting that. Regards Philip @ © talk 01:24, 20 September 2011 (UTC)
If I may be allowed to jump in here. Hathi can be damned as I can easily get my hands on a copy; the vocal score in question is readily available at dozens of libraries in the US. If so desired, I will gladly request the score and scan it if you wish. Daphnis 01:33, 20 September 2011 (UTC)
It’s probably not my place to request it, seeing as I’m in a life+70 zone; but I’m fairly sure there are a few US contributors (e.g. Eric S., Jason H.) who’d warmly congratulate you for the effort. Actually, speaking of Jason, you might want to check if he’s got access to a copy or a scan already. Philip @ © talk 01:42, 20 September 2011 (UTC)
Thanks, I've inquired with Jason. Daphnis 03:13, 20 September 2011 (UTC)


Hi Philip. You may have some thoughts on this :-) — P.davydov 10:20, 3 September 2011 (UTC)

Thanks, I shall! Philip @ © talk 10:54, 3 September 2011 (UTC)


Hi Philip, it took a while before I found the "Exemplum octo Modorum" - as a part of the Magnificat octo toni (verse XIIa). I'll upload it in a few minutes. Cheers --Ralph Theo Misch 23:24, 4 September 2011 (UTC)

Yes, the rest of the Mag is probably spurious. It’s just the Sicut erat which is Brumel’s. You didn’t think to look in the Brumel worklist? :-) Many, many thanks. Regards Philip @ © talk 23:27, 4 September 2011 (UTC)

I didn't have a look at the worklist - in the heat of battle ;) I'll email you... --Ralph Theo Misch 23:41, 4 September 2011 (UTC)

→"Heth. Cogitavit Dominus" (Lamentations): I hope it is just what you're looking for. Anyway, I've found nothing else, not even in the worklist. I'll upload it in a few minutes.
BTW: Thanks for your help with the work page of Magnificat 8.!! --Ralph Theo Misch 23:23, 5 September 2011 (UTC)
Sorry Christoph, this was a very bad habit, to assume you’d know as much about the œuvre as I do. The lamentations, of course, are not described as such in Hudson’s edition, but the incipit of the Hebrew letter “Heth” is the giveaway (as would be the case with a Latin setting of Psalm 118). In other words, you nailed it. ;-) Cheers and thanks again, Philip @ © talk 00:28, 6 September 2011 (UTC)


Hi PML. Thanks for helping with the copyright review - it's a lot of work. I'm wondering if it would be possible for you to simultaneously edit the pages when you helpfully tag them. Not editing during copyright review tends to make finding the unedited pages in the future more difficult. I'm sure that you probably save the pages for later; but this is just a gentle reminder in case you forgot. Thanks again for stepping in during this difficult time. Respectfully yours, Emery 02:43, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

I am usually editing pages as a matter of course; and also carrying out the Instrumentation/Genre tagging;; and taking general note of the quality of the typesetting to see whether it merits notice as being of below the acceptable standard according to our Typesetting Guidelines. I have not forgotten about various pages which I have not revisited since clearing their copyright review, but they can be edited by anyone; the copyright review and library teams are markedly fewer in number. Thanks for the reminder, Philip @ © talk 02:48, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

typesetting guidelines

Thanks for the support over Coulonnus' question, but he probably won't have gotten your comment since it's on my page, not his. I did think the same as you, but decided to rather just answer him nicely and let him draw his own conclusions . . . . Steltz 06:14, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

Christian Mondrup adding a sample composition

I'm continuing my own WIMA link WIMA->IMSLP documentation.

For that purpose I'm adding a composer page and a piece of my own while taking screen shots for the documentation. It's beyond midnight in Denmark; so I wait with the WIMA upload until later. Therefore the work page may stay without a score file for short while.

Reccmo 22:33, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

Hi Christian,
I saw your category page go up. I’ve no problem having a blank page there for some little time. Cheers, Philip @ © talk 22:36, 6 September 2011 (UTC)


Hi PML -- I know that the composer page for Kreisler you created states that his works are copyrighted worldwide, but I have a couple of scans of scores published before 1923 which could be uploaded to the US server. I know that technically it would be acceptable to do so, but I wanted to let you know first in case something needs to be changed on the composer page. Thanks! Massenetique talk email 07:31, 7 September 2011 (UTC)

Hi Massenetique,
yeah, if there were some pre-1923 stuff to go up we would change it back to using the normal template, stat. The page can be edited by sysops, so anyone who’s on deck can be deputised to unprotect the page and amend the first line. And of course, in year or so, it won’t be needed quite so badly since Kreiseler will be public domain so far as Canada is concerned.
Thanks, Philip @ © talk 07:45, 7 September 2011 (UTC)
Ok, great, I'll take care of that. Massenetique talk email 07:52, 7 September 2011 (UTC)
Awesome! Philip @ © talk 08:13, 7 September 2011 (UTC)

Marcello psalms

Hello Philip,

Thanks for your message. If you really think that it is better to have the psalms as separated works that's fine with me, as far as the page for the "Estro" -with the scan of the original edition- is maintained. I am in fact planning to transcribe all the psalms, but this will not be ready for next week! I have already done a few, but many more remain waiting...

Thank you again and best wishes. Damián H. Zanette 11:47, 7 September 2011 (UTC)

When you’ve edited all fifty of the “Estro”, be assured we will restore them to the complete page for the edition! Philip @ © talk 22:46, 7 September 2011 (UTC)
Well, I created my first page inside Benedetto's site, for Psalm 47... and I mistook the "work title" by the "alternative work title" (I must say the the instructions are not perfectly clear on this point). Sorry for this. Could you be so kind as to correct this? Thank you! Damián H. Zanette 01:15, 8 September 2011 (UTC)
No problems. Most of my work on the site at present seems to be tidying up after you lot! ;-) ;-) ;-) No malice intended; it’s great to have all these new works. Cheers, Philip
I remember reading about the Marcello Estro when a recording of a few of them was reviewed awhile back. Fascinating collection. In my honest opinion it will be great to have them (I admit I have not yet heard them but the review did leave me intrigued...!) - and I'd agree from what I read that separately is better, if the author was right about Marcello's sheer diversity of approach to instrumental and many other aspects of setting (word-setting, length, others ...) Eric 02:50, 8 September 2011 (UTC)
Eric, you do know Boccaccio uploaded scans of the entire set in the first edition, don’t you? Philip @ © talk 03:16, 8 September 2011 (UTC)

Benvenuto Cellini

I got my hands on the last full score in the Berlioz collection today and will be adding it soon. I (really, we) would appreciate your usual superb editorial notes on this edition when you see it come down the pipeline. Daphnis 21:38, 8 September 2011 (UTC)

Wonderful news. The textual issues with the Weimar version of the score frankly make Les Troyens look like a walk in the park, though! Thanks in advance, Phi1ip 22:41, 8 September 2011 (UTC)
Well, I look forward to reading your revealing notes on the subject. FYI, this is a Kalmus miniature reprint of the Choudens ~460 page original. Daphnis 22:53, 8 September 2011 (UTC)
Maître, I've uploaded the full score to Benvenuto Cellini. The wiki is now ready for your editorial magic. Daphnis 03:23, 21 October 2011 (UTC)


Hi PML. Do you know how to transfer the complete MP3 files from [ this] site to IMSLP? I really don't know anything about computers. Respectfully, Emery 01:17, 12 September 2011 (UTC)

Looking at his MP3 page, some of these works have been commercially released, so Lansky himself may not be permitted to redistribute them if he is not the sole uhh, commercial stakeholder. You’ll note the commercially available pieces are available at iTunes. Unless you have been in contact with Mr Lansky to okay the hosting of these at IMSLP I’d be hesitant to transfer them – especially the ones citing a recording company label and disc number.
As for the mechanics of cross-loading them to IMSLP; I’m not sure if you can simply specify their address on the web to have IMSLP pull them across in one step. It would be fairly straight-forward, though, to use the “right-click” “save this file to hard disk” method to download them to your own computer, and then upload to IMSLP (a not-so-quick two-step). Cheers, Philip @ © talk 01:26, 12 September 2011 (UTC)

You are right about the commercially available recordings; however, there are recordings that are not commercially available on the website. For those, Mr. Lansky did explicitly give his permission for them to he hosted on IMSLP as well. Respectfully, Emery 01:30, 12 September 2011 (UTC)

Wonderful. Well, there are some ways that you can specify URLs for other sites, but I tend to leave those to people who know what they’re doing. It might be safer to use the two-step approach I mentioned above. PML

Scheidt: Tabulatura Nova

Hi − I merged all the 3 so-called 'Magnificat verses' by Scheidt (files from WIMA) into the Tabulatora Nova page − I took time to find these verses in the DDT edition; actually, 2 of them aren't Magnificat verses. Did I do it in the proper way?

I retained the qualification of 'Arrangements and transcriptions', although I'm not sure this files deserve it more than old editions like Guilmant's or Bonnet's, even Seiffert's "Urtext" has not the right clefs, barlines, etc. Cheers − Pierre Ch. 10:08, 12 September 2011 (UTC)

That looks fine, Pierre. Apologies for the late reply. Philip @ © talk 01:02, 27 September 2011 (UTC)

Scheidt: Cantiones sacrae

Hi Philip, frankly, I do not get it. Obviously there are missing three part-books. Or? Thanks and regards --Ralph Theo Misch 21:23, 22 September 2011 (UTC)

Looks like Wroclaw lost three of their eight books in the intervening centuries. It does happen that way. Hopefully another library will have a complete or a differential set that covers the loss. Cheers, Philip @ © talk 00:54, 27 September 2011 (UTC)

Re C Holiday

ah, just noticed your response. Ok; he may respond if he wishes to when he (carolus) returns from holiday. I was about to be off on vacation myself at the time (and about a day later did just that for a week). In future I shall attempt to remember to check the forums for holiday announcements before ... well, this excepted, because I am making this response to you whether you are on holiday, in hospital or deceased. Eric 06:18, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

Status: On holiday. Not in hospital. Not dead. [Score: 33⅓%; Comments: Try harder.] Philip @ © talk 00:59, 27 September 2011 (UTC)

Met opera portal

This is the page, so far—could you please help with formatting, perhaps? Also, where should we place this on the site? Cheers-- Snailey (_@/) Talk to Me Email me 21:16, 16 October 2011 (UTC)

I think we should be bold, and place the current season’s operas somewhere like The Met and the archives on pages such as The Met/Archive 2008-09, The Met/Archive 2009-10, etc. The home page should also have a small introductory (not too historical in depth) paragraph in the way that our pages for publishers occasionally have a tasty morsel of info before getting down to the tables of plate numbers. I see you’re currently editing away, so I’ll wait until you’re finished… Philip @ © talk 21:55, 16 October 2011 (UTC)

Hi Perlnerd666 and PML. I never knew about this project, but it looks very good. I wonder if we could do this with other performing houses, orchestras, and choirs. I think it's possible that La traviata is not capitalized, but I'm sure there's a good reason it's capitalized on the list. Very nice work so far. Respectfully yours, Emery 22:39, 16 October 2011 (UTC)

Old voices name - clefs

Hello, Philip. Thank you very much for your useful, interesting explanation about ancient clefs. About Jubilate,Gabrieli is it preferrable to "tranlsate" old voicies name --> new ones? If so, the complete score voice clefs are:

G2 - cantus (S)
G2 - 7° (S)
G2 - altus (A)
C3 - 5° (A)
G2-8 - tenor (T)
C4 - 8° (T)
C4 - 9° (T)
C4 - 10° (T)
F4 - 6° (B)
F4 - bassus (B)

I'm not sure it is a correct division suitable for a chorus (SSAATTTTBB)...Tell me if not! Anyway may inserting this division inside instruments field of the page be sufficient (to help taggers and players)? Cheers, jeko89 14:11, 19 October 2011 (UTC).

The way I normally describe instrumentation for composers like Gabrieli/Monteverdi is to give the SATB form first, and then in brackets or on a separate line go into the nitty gritty of what clefs were used in the original edition. Here’s the thing though: Fritz Broderson’s edition is a modern score, and the presence of at least one G2 octava clef (for the tenor part) means that this is not the original clef used by Gabrieli, and I presume some of Fritz’s other clef choices are pragmatic modern ones (such as G2 for an alto part!). The Decimus part is not really a tenor part even though it is cleffed as C4. The opening Sinfonia requires at least 8 instruments along with Gabrieli’s basso continuo (basso pro organo); despite a marking like Solo senza stromenti these sections can be treated as one solo voice (cantus, altus, or tenor) plus instruments and can cite one famous recording which does this. The default consort is 2 cornetti (not the same as modern cornets!), 5 sackbutts (ancient trombones), bassoon, basso continuo; and optionally, 2 more sackbutts to double the alto and tenor parts colla parte, which otherwise have no obbligato instrumental writing.
Sorry this is complicated, but you chose one of the more “experimental” Renaissance works to ask this question of. Hope this helps. Cheers Philip @ © talk 21:37, 19 October 2011 (UTC)

WIMA Uploads

(Thank you for your help to the above section!) I've just read your warning about my recent WIMA uploads. I've tried to read WIMA project page and related doc. but I didn't find how to set info field for modified WIMA pdf before you told me! A couple of days ago I asked Carolus but he told me s.t. like: "yes, tag them as {{WIMAProject}}", not as {{WIMAProject|Yes}}. And I didn't find documentation for this. That's why I was sure it was correct :)

  • All my past upload if already present in IMSLP were tagged as {{WIMAProject|Yes}}" but, not in Log page (I've just realized I should have done it :()
  • Now I've tagged in that way the uploads (18th Oct. and 19th Oct.) of modified files too
Tomorrow I'll put (or I'll do my best to put) either type of mine uploads in Log page.
Thank for precious help.--jeko89 00:34, 20 October 2011 (UTC)
I've Logged concerto 312 and 313.
some facts :
- some links of mine in log page are broken. No file suggestion. (I suppose they're the separate files, sources for merging pdf, never uploaded to imslp. They were useless, according to mods)
- some other links of mine in log page are broken. They suggest a file in imslp server uploaded with WIMAuploader (I uploaded them before realize that they're useless)
- my last two links in log page are alive. They reports the original wima file hosted at wima servers
Have I done things correctly (I asked reccmo too as you told me)?
If so, I'continue logging other files tomorrow...
thank you! --jeko89 01:32, 21 October 2011 (UTC)

RaNdOm FaCt

Jean-Philippe Rameau.jpg This excellent composer...Died of a foot infection.
Hope you enjoy this totally random fact!

Here's a random fact with a picture to go along with it! Enjoy!

Benedict 07:35, 3 November 2011 (UTC)

I think you meant this guy — not Rameau! But thanks for the randomness of your posting. Cheers, Philip @ © talk 01:43, 8 November 2011 (UTC)

Sortable WIKI table for presenting Frederic Rzewski's compositions

Hello Philip.

I've been discussing with Carolus the presentation of the compositions by Frederic Rzewski in his IMSLP composer page. I'd like to offer the list by other sort criteria than just alphabetize titles, for example composition year. Carolus mentions the use of a WIKI table and suggests me to contact you as an expert on this matter.

Would you consider preparing a sortable presentation table for Rzewski's oeuvre - or point me to a thorough documentation on how to prepare it? --Reccmo 16:13, 25 November 2011 (UTC)